wanted - £25k to breed black bees

[alanf]

...I struggle to reconcile "natural beekeeping" with queen rearing and breeding (as more than one poster said). It would appear modern beekeeping techniques are fine if they are necessary in a breeding program....

"Natural" beekeeping is whatever the advocate says it is. What is it about beekeeping that attracts the "one true path" believers? Should they be encouraged to take up a more tolerant hobby? Maybe religion or revolutionary politics.

 

[pargyle]

I notice that the term 'balanced beekeeping' is now being used for people who wanted to do treatment free but found it too tricky. The only thing I can find that differentiates it from mainstream beekeeping is that you aren't the BBKA.

Does it really matter what label you put on your beekeeping ... we all have different ways of doing things ?

I think there are a lot of beekeepers who are now trying to be less dependent upon the use of treatments for the likes of varroa, people who are interfering less in the bees natural order of doing things their way, allowing the bees to keep sufficient honey stores to overwinter without the need for excessive amounts of sugar, inspecting only for a purpose, allowing bees to build comb without foundation and a few other 'unconventional' methods. If doing any or all of this constitutes 'balanced', 'natural', 'low interference' or one of the other beekeeping labels that some people wish to attribute to a different style of keeping bees - then that categorises me.

But .. I'm not sure that it is people who find it too difficult to go 'treatment free' that has driven the desire for yet another name for a style of beekeeping, it seems to me that it is people being driven away from the name 'natural beekeeper' because of the criticism and skepticism from those on the extreme end of 'conventional beekeeping' and criticism and skepticism from those at the extreme end of 'natural beekeeping'. Sitting astride the rail in the middle of the fence can be uncomfortable at times and it is not everyone that likes to be constantly challenged, from both sides, about what they are doing.

If you have a philosophy then it ought to be tempered with a degree of pragmatism and whilst I would love to say that I would NEVER treat my bees with anything the reality is, in today's beekeeping world, it would be foolish to be so dogmatic. Equally, if I think there is something that I feel would be good for my bees that I see in beekeeping anywhere then I am not averse to trying it. Paraphrasing Napoleon "No battle plan ever survives contact with the enemy" is much the case in beekeeping IMO.

I try not to get hung up on labels and tread a path that I feel is working for me and my bees - I've seen immense bigotry in all types/styles of beekeeping from a few people and prejudices that are based solely on dogma. An open mind seems to me to be the biggest asset in beekeeping - so perhaps there should be a new category 'Open minded beekeeper' to describe those of us with a more tolerant and progressive view of the beekeeping world. Most of us on here I would hope .....

 

[mbc]

describe those of us with a more .....

Drawing lines, causing division, them and us.

I'm with the people's front me, everyone else are SPLITTERS !

 

[psafloyd]

Proper natural beekeeping practices then..

 

[mbc]

But you cannot husband bees in the same way you do pigs, MBC.

Indeed.
Air fences are tricky, and not many of us are wealthy enough to own all of a colony's habitat.

 

[pargyle]

Drawing lines, causing division, them and us.

I'm with the people's front me, everyone else are SPLITTERS !

"describe those of us with a more ...... tolerant and progressive view of the beekeeping world"

Hardly divisive ?

 

[madasafish]

An open mind seems to me to be the biggest asset in beekeeping - so perhaps there should be a new category 'Open minded beekeeper' to describe those of us with a more tolerant and progressive view of the beekeeping world. Most of us on here I would hope .....

I'm open minded. It's the rest of you lot that are the problem....

 

[domino]

Does it really matter what label you put on your beekeeping ... we all have different ways of doing things ?

I personally have never cared how other people keep bees. I'm just commenting on the phenomenon that some who've espoused top-bars and denigrated framed hive are now re-marketing their way of adoption framed hives as 'balanced beekeeping'.

It's an observation rather than a criticism.

 

[Fritillary]

100% with your last post Pargyle. Except that 'open minded beekeeper' is something I'm going to have to aspire to, as will be having to check on an hourly basis to see if I'm being open minded and tolerant... about anything...

But I'd forgotten: one of the contributors to the 'natural beekeeping' forum described himself once, when talking about differences in procedures in diff. kinds of hives, as "a horizontal beekeeper" . I decided that was definitely what I was going to aim for.

 

[Finman]

.
Horizontal beekeeper sounds good.

But why Black Bee makes guys so poetic

 

[For want of a better word]

'Open minded beekeeper'

I resemble that remark!!!


However I do find all those with an unwillingness to accept any of my own ideas a little churlish!!

Yeghes da

 

[Thymallus]

.
But why Black Bee makes guys so poetic

Moral high ground, bit like dry fly only fishermen.
Although you may be confusing poetic with zealot in some cases

 

[For want of a better word]

.
Horizontal beekeeper sounds good.

But why Black Bee makes guys so poetic

​

.....Another bad effect of this term (OLD ENGLISH BEE) is the embarrassment caused by those who claim to have discovered a last remnant of " old English bees", usually in some remote area. Our bees - probably 90% of them in most areas - are the native or near-native British Isles bees of today, not hybrids, mongrels or "old" bees. Let us call them what they are and not undersell our products. Many areas where selection is against dark pigmentation may yet have bees that are predominantly near-native despite appearances to the contrary.
We must not let prejudice deter us from recognising this fact.

To quote Beowulf a Cooper - The Honeybees of the British Isles.

Poetry indeed, rather than the comic strip prejudice written by Mr Manley

Suggested reading for Grayling man and Carp fisher!!


Yeghes da

 

[clv101]

Well as there seems to be loads of people with loads of cash to give away, maybe I should get them to fund a few worthwhile and beneficial projects I'd love to launch in Lesotho.

Indeed, there is a lot of money out there. You just need to find a way to ask for / justify it. Crowdsourcing has raised billions over the last few years.

 

[Thymallus]

​

To quote Beowulf a Cooper - The Honeybees of the British Isles.
Poetry indeed, rather than the comic strip prejudice written by Mr Manley
Suggested reading for Grayling man and Carp fisher!!
Yeghes da

Read it. it's quite embarrassingly bad. I know it was cobbled together from his notes after he died. But its so full of prejudice that it's quite amateurish. Sad really, given his reputation as a professional entomologist.
I think village bee improvement about sums it up.
At least with Manley you get the sense that the guy knew what he was writing about, despite his long winded way of saying anything.

Anyone want a 1st edition Cooper in good nick.........

 

[pargyle]

.

It's an observation rather than a criticism.

Exactly the way I took it ... but it was a convenient introduction for a bit of a rant as I get increasingly fed up of those people who set themselves up in a particular corner of beekeeping and cannot see anything good in any of the other corners.

As I said, the modern beekeeping world really needs open minds and the ability to change - or at least try different ideas. The 'this is the way I do it and anything else is wrong' is pretty entrenched in some beekeeping circles and those people need to get out a bit ...

 

[BeeJayBee]

As I said, the modern beekeeping world really needs open minds and the ability to change - or at least try different ideas. The 'this is the way I do it and anything else is wrong' is pretty entrenched in some beekeeping circles and those people need to get out a bit ...

It's the ones who keep on bragging about how they've been keeping bees for 'n' years, so know all there is to know about beekeeping, that often do the most damage because they have such a closed mind.

 

[madasafish]

It's the ones who keep on bragging about how they've been keeping bees for 'n' years, so know all there is to know about beekeeping, that often do the most damage because they have such a closed mind.

Hmm... I can't think of any...

 

[Finman]

O

As I said, the modern beekeeping world really needs open minds and the ability to change - or at least try different ideas...

Hmm. In Uk beekeeping style, when 80% keep their few hives on backyard, it is vain to speak about "beekeeping world". It is very different to speak in Canada, where 80% are professionals.

My advice to all beekeepers is, that even if you are a beekeeper, you need not loose your mind.
Be selective, do not let your bees suffer for all kind of ideas.

Forum beekeepers seems to be own kind of human race, and not very good as beekeepers. It is more social happening and far from "beekeeping world". Be carefull, and do not pick too much stupid ideas from forums.

 

[For want of a better word]

Anyone want a 1st edition Cooper in good nick.........

is it signed !!!!!!!???


Finman.. not all of the postees on forums are filled with stupid ideas... just most of them!

Yeghes da