Which way to go regarding poly

[Morgan968]

Hi everyone

I'm rather intrigued about the polystyrene hives and I no this is a well used topic as I've been through and read them on here over the last few days trying to research which way to go but frankly so many different views etc it's hard to choose, I use a 14x12 national frame so keeping with this is important and there are a few which have taken my fancy such as the;

Maismore 14x12 hive
Paynes 14x12 hive

I have my reservations about the abelo hives which a few people on here seem to comment as being the better ones then again in the same breathe people say the paynes is a little soft but is better at taking wooden boxes if needed than maismore and not much more is said about the maismore hive. So I'm looking for more reviews/experiences regarding these along with the others?

Is this positive towards abelo due to having so many... 50+ hives, it's easy for paiting wise, interchangable with normal national wooden hive parts, moving around etc but yet I do like the plastic surrounds on the edges and the runners...... I just cant stop thinking negatively about all the plugs you've got to install that could lead to issues and to be personally honest I'll probably not even use half of them and the crown board is terrible with the 14x12 size again I wouldnt be sticking multiple Nuc's on over winter.

Swienty hives I've also looked at and really like the look of the build I.e the dovetails etc but the fact the walls seem much thinner in a lot of places and also the bee space seems to be such an issue I'll stay clear.

This hive will be a tester hive into the world of poly hives so I'd like to get one which isnt going to damage or break easy as being too brittle, not too bothered in terms of interchangeable with cedar either and mainly one which is more forgiving towards a newbie in the world of bee keeping as my other hives are cedar

 

[For want of a better word]

I have cedar BS National hives too, but have veered away from the 14 x 12 format.

Have you looked at these ones from Bee Hive Supplies in Cornwall I think?
I like to try and buy UK made products as I do think about airmiles!

https://www.beehivesupplies.co.uk/i...dex&cPath=23&zenid=11iq8uks6m32dmk6f9ge8lli47

 

[Madge]

...

.. I just cant stop thinking negatively about all the plugs you've got to install that could lead to issues and to be personally honest I'll probably not even use half of them and the crown board is terrible with the 14x12 size ...

I recommend to choose one of the poly hives with a small footprint. They are Abelo and Swienty. Don't even look at the Paradise ones.

And between those two I'd choose the Abelo. The Swienty has beespace issues. The Abelo just works all over. You don't have to 'install' any plugs. They're there, and if you don't use them - fine. Just forget about them. But they are handy when you're moving hives. You replace the white plugs with ventilated plugs.

The crown board is certainly not terrible - particularly useful in winter to have an insulated crown board. Again, if you don't like the plugs, just glue them shut.

Small footprint hives (apart from Paradise BeeBox) are the most compatible with wooden hives.

As for the big footprint hives - ignore them. But if you insist: The Paynes poly is weak and bees can nibble holes in them. And they have a terrible landing board.

I don't know about Maisemore hives. The one by Beehive Supplies is probably the best - but the entrance reducer is not so good.

Go for Abelo.

 

[Poly Hive]

I only have Maisy nucs but the poly seems to be fine.

Paynes have sadly more than a few design issues.

I know there are Abelo lovers but I think they are too hard.

I personally use Swienty and no runners and they work very well for me indeed. I am not that bothered about the runners and the absence makes no odds to how things work for me.

I don't myself like 14 x 12 preferring the double brood format for flexibility and it suits my bees.

Poly overall is preferred by the bees and they thrive in them. I say prefered as over the years I have seen swarm after swarm pick poly rather than timber. It's that simple.

Good luck

PH

 

[Angry_Mob]

When researching my original poly hive I fairly quickly ruled out Maisimore and Paynes for the reason above, the external dimensions mean that cross compatibility is compromised, that is fine if you stick solely with their product however there is two problems with that other than the aesthetics; one is that if they change the design in the future you cant source any new kit and the second is if they increase prices dramatically you are stuffed.

The Swienty internal dimensions are a bit off as is only takes ten frames internally, however thats what I originally ordered. I'm not sure now in hindsight how I missed the Abelo hive but I now know it was mistake and plan to sell my remaining Swienty hive which I have had major quality issues with and could not recommend.

Don't let the plugs put you off and if you really hate them for aesthetics fill them in and paint over the top. I do like the crown boards once the discs are screwed closed.


I'm assuming the Bee Hive Supplies hive from the photos isn't a standard national foot print either?

 

[Angry_Mob]

I also considered the Paradise Hive for quite a while, that was ruled out for the propreiaty lip incorporated which means it's not cross compatible either.

 

[Millet]

I know there are Abelo lovers but I think they are too hard.

PH

I think a poo bag is needed to clear that comment up..

 

[Erichalfbee]

I think a poo bag is needed to clear that comment up..

Now that’s not very helpful is it?
If you disagree then maybe just say so, politely?

 

[Millet]

Now that’s not very helpful is it?
If you disagree then maybe just say so, politely?

That is polite if i do not say so my self..

 

[Morgan968]

Thank you for such quick responses....

you raise some good points there Angry_Mob regarding the fact if they were to change anything with their mold then I would be stuffed with potentially having to switch all my gear. I understand how you mean about them not being fully compatible due to the wider footprint but this wasnt really something I was thinking wouldnt be an issue as I wasnt planning to mismatch poly and cedar...raising your comment previously mentioned has opened my eyes actually a bit to the fact even if stuck with either maismore or even paynes....

I am slightly more swayed towards abelo currently

 

[Morgan968]

I only have Maisy nucs but the poly seems to be fine.

Paynes have sadly more than a few design issues.

I know there are Abelo lovers but I think they are too hard.

I personally use Swienty and no runners and they work very well for me indeed. I am not that bothered about the runners and the absence makes no odds to how things work for me.

I don't myself like 14 x 12 preferring the double brood format for flexibility and it suits my bees.

Poly overall is preferred by the bees and they thrive in them. I say prefered as over the years I have seen swarm after swarm pick poly rather than timber. It's that simple.

Good luck

PH

Thank you for this about the paynes hives, I see where your coming from regarding double brood but I've never worked that way, I suppose in future as I become more and more confident I may move that way in an apriay as currently I've only got 3 hives with the looking of starting a poly one.

Regarding the no runners this would give you top bee space if I'm not mistaken, how do you find this as I've always used bottom?

 

[Erichalfbee]

Thank you for this about the paynes hives, I see where your coming from regarding double brood but I've never worked that way, I suppose in future as I become more and more confident I may move that way in an apriay as currently I've only got 3 hives with the looking of starting a poly one.

Regarding the no runners this would give you top bee space if I'm not mistaken, how do you find this as I've always used bottom?

I run top space and have altered all my poly boxes ( Swienty and Abelo) with an eke glued on. Tried the Swienty without runners. Messy.

 

[Morgan968]

I recommend to choose one of the poly hives with a small footprint. They are Abelo and Swienty. Don't even look at the Paradise ones.

And between those two I'd choose the Abelo. The Swienty has beespace issues. The Abelo just works all over. You don't have to 'install' any plugs. They're there, and if you don't use them - fine. Just forget about them. But they are handy when you're moving hives. You replace the white plugs with ventilated plugs.
.

Thank you for this, i see your points regarding just installing the plugs and leaving them there unless need them in future, I suppose I've never even thought about using them. I also understand and agree regarding the crown board

 

[Madge]

...
Regarding the no runners this would give you top bee space if I'm not mistaken, how do you find this as I've always used bottom?

This will only give you a hive like the original Swienty, avoiding the top lugs touching the bottom of the boxes above it. And you have the discomfort of having no lug-risers, potentially squashing bees.

 

[Beefriendly]

Thank you for this, i see your points regarding just installing the plugs and leaving them there unless need them in future, I suppose I've never even thought about using them. I also understand and agree regarding the crown board

Take a look at the new Abelo crownboard...one single hole.
Doubles as travel screen/feeder hole/attach thing is clearer board etcetera arc.

 

[Poly Hive]

Frankly TBS is far better than bottom as the bees are more out the way when adding excluders and supers.

There are very good reasons for Langstroth to be the most popular hive in the world it's just us that are stuck with the local to the UK nonsense.

Re the no runners my bees are not very sticky bees in that propolis is not a big issue for me. If it were then my thinking might be different.

PH

 

[pargyle]

As for the big footprint hives - ignore them. But if you insist: The Paynes poly is weak and bees can nibble holes in them. And they have a terrible landing board.

Like everything in beekeeping it's a matter of personal opinion .. I've never found Paynes Poly hives weak in any respect. I've never had bees nibble holes in them - wax moth grubs - yes .. but wax moth grubs will eat into cedar hives so nothing is safe from them.

I've no issues with the landing boards .. the bees seem to like them but there has always been the debate between those who are pro landing boards and those against.

All my poly ones are Paynes and I like them .. good value and made in one piece which I like.

The only downsides are the fact that they don't mix particularly well with timber hives but I'm not a fan of mixing up timber and poly anyway - defeats the object of having Poly - and the lugs on the floors to locate the brood boxes have upsides and downsides. I don't find them as inconvenient as some would suggest ...

They are also on sale at present ... if they have any left.

https://www.paynesbeefarm.co.uk/pol...ly-14x12-jumbo-national-hive-empty-no-frames/

Roger Payne is also a very nice and helpful man who knows his beekeeping and his team are superb.

 

[Madge]

Like everything in beekeeping it's a matter of personal opinion .. I've never found Paynes Poly hives weak in any respect.

It's not 'opinion', Pargyle - it's fact. The weak spots are the indents that form part of the moulding/casting process. I can't find a photo showing bees using their new self-made entrances - but I attach a photo of a box where I've filled in the problem spots. I'm not the only one who's had problems with them. I've seen it mention often.

I've no issues with the landing boards .. the bees seem to like them but there has always been the debate between those who are pro landing boards and those against. ...

I generally like landing boards - but the Paynes one is just too big to my liking. And yes - that's 'opinion'.

 

[SDM]

It's not 'opinion', Pargyle - it's fact. The weak spots are the indents that form part of the moulding/casting process. I can't find a photo showing bees using their new self-made entrances - but I attach a photo of a box where I've filled in the problem spots. I'm not the only one who's had problems with them. I've seen it mention often.

.

I've around 450 paynes boxes, not a single one been chewed.

 

[Madge]

I've around 450 paynes boxes, not a single one been chewed.

Thanks SDM. In my experience, it remains a fact that my Paynes hives were chewed, and that the bees created new entrances - but perhaps I received a wonky batch of hives.

I only had three hives and sold them all - not so much for that reason (as I could mend them), but because of the lugs (I forgot about them until Pargyle mentioned them), and the large footprint.