Still big varroa drop

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charlievictorbravo said:
T
The question that's lurking at the back of my mind is "are we breeding a strain of mites that are phoretic for only 1 or 2 days because strains that are on bees for longer than that get zapped by condensing OA crystals?" Surely, OA sublimation is too recent a human activity for this to be happening. Answers on a postcard please and do try to stay on topic!

CVB
Click to expand...

It's lurking at the back of Wally Shaw's mind too.
See Wally's article "What did I mean by the right bee?"
Pages 16/17 in particular.
https://view.publitas.com/welsh-beekeeper/197autumn2017/page/1
 
.
To cabin fever

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charlievictorbravo said:
The difficulty, as I see it, of investigating further is that you have to identify the "problem" hives and this is probably only possible if the hives are close to the beek - i.e. in their garden. I can testify to the time-consuming nature of carrying out a mites count on a daily basis and it's only if you do this do you identify both the "problem" hives and the trends in mite drop. If your apiaries are 5 miles away or more, you probably only visit once a week so spotting trends is not so easy.

"Problem" hives may be quite common but as most beekeepers do not do regular routine monitoring before and after treatment there may be , say, 1 in 10 hives that continues to have a significant infestation even after treatment and goes into winter like that so that the health of winter bees is compromised. That hive dies in the spring and its demise is put down to some other explanation.

I thought the cause might be associated with the way certain passive vapourisers work but Beef's using an active vapouriser that should squirt OA vapour under pressure into all parts of the brood chamber, even when it's crowded with bees.

The question that's lurking at the back of my mind is "are we breeding a strain of mites that are phoretic for only 1 or 2 days because strains that are on bees for longer than that get zapped by condensing OA crystals?" Surely, OA sublimation is too recent a human activity for this to be happening. Answers on a postcard please and do try to stay on topic!

CVB
Click to expand...

Good summary.
My boards go in at the start of OAV so easy to monitor drop on next treament by day 4-5. I agree with beef. no need to monitor outside the treatment sessions. I would like to have a clearer guide on when no second treatment is required based on the numbers dropped after the first treatment. The decision will vary depending on the time of the season & state of the colony.
 
There is some american research that says in a temperate climate then the cull ate of Apiguard in large hives with top ventilation is around 67% not 95% as per the Italian trials. I now always block feed holes when using apiguard.
 
MuswellMetro said:
There is some american research that says in a temperate climate then the cull ate of Apiguard in large hives with top ventilation is around 67% not 95% as per the Italian trials. I now always block feed holes when using apiguard.
Click to expand...

That's interesting as far as Apiguard is concerned but the issues from earlier in the thread and on other threads was that several beeks had heavy mite infestations that were not responding to multiple vapings with OA but do appear to have responded to Apivar (Amitraz).

CVB
 
Erichalfbee said:
It's lurking at the back of Wally Shaw's mind too.
See Wally's article "What did I mean by the right bee?"
Pages 16/17 in particular.
https://view.publitas.com/welsh-beekeeper/197autumn2017/page/1
Click to expand...

W.S. seems to think that his virulent mites came from bees imported into Anglesey by a new honey farm business. For all of us with "problem" hives to have similar mites, we'd have to have people using imported bees near us. While this is possible I think it's unlikely but, to be honest, I don't know the extent of bee imports to Cornwall and Devon.

My money is still on mites, statistically quite a small proportion perhaps in the lower 5 percentile, that do not spend the usually accepted 5 days in the phoretic stage - the shorter the phoretic stage, the better their chances of survival during a vaping treatment. Any research been done on length of phoretic stage of mites in a temperate climate?

CVB
 
charlievictorbravo said:
W.S. seems to think that his virulent mites came from bees imported into Anglesey by a new honey farm business. For all of us with "problem" hives to have similar mites, we'd have to have people using imported bees near us. While this is possible I think it's unlikely but, to be honest, I don't know the extent of bee imports to Cornwall and Devon.

My money is still on mites, statistically quite a small proportion perhaps in the lower 5 percentile, that do not spend the usually accepted 5 days in the phoretic stage - the shorter the phoretic stage, the better their chances of survival during a vaping treatment. Any research been done on length of phoretic stage of mites in a temperate climate?

CVB
Click to expand...

And some people say that it will be impossible for varroa to evolve resistance to OA!
 
JWF said:
And some people say that it will be impossible for varroa to evolve resistance to OA!
Click to expand...

It's a worrying thought
Amitraz resistance is also being reported in the States
Perhaps we will end up using it ONLY in broodless hives and Ratnieks was right all along?
 
Erichalfbee said:
It's a worrying thought
Amitraz resistance is also being reported in the States
Perhaps we will end up using it ONLY in broodless hives and Ratnieks was right all along?
Click to expand...

Ratnieks makes his basic researches 15 years later than others. Better be right then. But he is not.
 
charlievictorbravo said:
W.S. seems to think that his virulent mites came from bees imported into Anglesey by a new honey farm business. For all of us with "problem" hives to have similar mites, we'd have to have people using imported bees near us. While this is possible I think it's unlikely but, to be honest, I don't know the extent of bee imports to Cornwall and Devon.

My money is still on mites, statistically quite a small proportion perhaps in the lower 5 percentile, that do not spend the usually accepted 5 days in the phoretic stage - the shorter the phoretic stage, the better their chances of survival during a vaping treatment. Any research been done on length of phoretic stage of mites in a temperate climate?

CVB
Click to expand...


Wally's imaginary super mites have affected colonies that he believed did not require treatment.
I find it a little disappointing that the WBKA technical officer is so confused by higher mite loads after 2 of the warmest winters in history. Nobody in the area experienced any brood break in those winters, yet this "scientist" can't comprehend that bees that may have "barely" developed tolerance to mites could have this balance tipped by a 12mth brooding season. Not to mention how this longer season will have affected the colonies of wild and less observant Beekeepers. Their collapse will have had an impact too. His comments have far more to do with personal agenda than the arrival of a super mite. A bit disappointing from a leading light in Welsh Beekeeping.
More importantly, his comments have no connection with the topic of mites that appear to be surviving multiple treatments.
 
SDM said:
Wally's imaginary super mites have affected colonies that he believed did not require treatment.
I find it a little disappointing that the WBKA technical officer is so confused by higher mite loads after 2 of the warmest winters in history. Nobody in the area experienced any brood break in those winters, yet this "scientist" can't comprehend that bees that may have "barely" developed tolerance to mites could have this balance tipped by a 12mth brooding season. Not to mention how this longer season will have affected the colonies of wild and less observant Beekeepers. Their collapse will have had an impact too. His comments have far more to do with personal agenda than the arrival of a super mite. A bit disappointing from a leading light in Welsh Beekeeping.
More importantly, his comments have no connection with the topic of mites that appear to be surviving multiple treatments.
Click to expand...

Agree.

I had the same problem last year of vaping not clearing a huge mite load despite 4 x 5 day vapes.. and assumed it was due to mites in brood.

Perhaps I too have a super mite infestation?

An experienced beekeeper writing speculative theories with zero evidence.. where is the scientific method? Theory, test, compare..

I blame the edukation sistim.
 
SDM said:
Wally's imaginary super mites have affected colonies that he believed did not require treatment.
I find it a little disappointing that the WBKA technical officer is so confused by higher mite loads after 2 of the warmest winters in history. Nobody in the area experienced any brood break in those winters, yet this "scientist" can't comprehend that bees that may have "barely" developed tolerance to mites could have this balance tipped by a 12mth brooding season.
More importantly, his comments have no connection with the topic of mites that appear to be surviving multiple treatments.
Click to expand...

I have friends in Southern California where their Italians breed all year. They do an OAV round four times a year and grab every opportunity with splits and swarms to use oxalic. They keep on top of it.
 
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