Worst winter ever

[bontbee]

Why can't you guys just argue, debate, or discuss whatever it is, without resorting to personal insults, profanity and nasty accusations, would be so easy to do, and much less culling for Admin or me to do.

Hear, hear, HM. Must be a nightmare for you and Admin, and is pretty tedious for (most of) the rest of us.

 

[Karol]

Reminds me a bit of the propagandists that were employed by the former USSR. I assume that you don't get paid or that you gifted your academic salary to pay the tuition fees of at least some of your students?

And seeing as you weren't a party to the discussions who are you to say what went down?

For the record we constructed an artificial project which cost a fortune so that our chap could finish his masters.[/QUOTE

So I take it you did intend to make a profit from saving lives i.e Industrial research.
Nowt wrong with that as long as it's done openly.
The whole point of university intellectual copyright is to ensure that if they (academic university research) discovered (for example) THe cure for ALL cancers it becomes public knowledge, not a copyright held by a company whose sole aim is profit. Naturally many companies try to take advantage of the universities education system. And if it was industrial research that discovered the cure, they + shareholders would get very rich.
Nowt wrong with that either. It's life.
After all it's what your company was doing.

The academics that I know that discover 'cure all for cancers' from within academia set up spin off businesses that use the IP for profit so spare me the lecture on ideals that don't exist. The system is bent and I don't see many academics trying to make it right probably because of the inflated salaries and perks that they get.

And for the record we don't use universities for research because generally standards have fallen so low that it's not worth the hassle. As for our chap and his masters you seem to be missing the point. The university would not be doing the research, our chap would in our labs funded by us and under our direction. All the university would do is steal the IP and take credit for 'peer' reviewing the work and publishing it under their name having taken a massive fee for the privilege. And if we then wanted to use our own IP we would have to licence it back from the university. The whole set up stinks and I have to say, apprenticeships are far better than what the majority of university courses have to offer and they provide far greater opportunities to improve social mobility to boot by not strangling students with massive debts to fund people like you.

 

[Karol]

Hear, hear, HM. Must be a nightmare for you and Admin, and is pretty tedious for (most of) the rest of us.

I'm sorry you find it tedious Bontbee.

I'm afraid it's one of those things that winds me up. It galls me to have academics preach at me when I watch them exploit thousands of students and saddle them with crippling debts for most of the rest of their lives just so they get big fat academic salaries. A student coming from a disadvantaged background going to university for three years will have to pay back £112,000 over 22 years to pay for the privilege if they earn £30k per annum. And that's at our historically low interest rates. If interest rates go up that figure will balloon beyond belief. Academic blood suckers.

Bring back free university tuition for courses that bring value to the economy, slash university places to 17% and bring back skilled apprenticeships. That would set our economy in the right direction and make it fairer for our youth.

 

[bontbee]

discuss whatever it is, without resorting to personal insults, profanity and nasty accusations,.

That's the bits I find tedious, Karol

 

[Karol]

That's the bits I find tedious, Karol

If I have overstepped myself then I apologise. Sorry!

 

[Hivemaker.]

If I have overstepped myself then I apologise. Sorry!

No, no more than many others, Karol, including myself on the odd rare occasion, but things have been getting worse just recently, we have already deleted 76 complete posts from this thread a couple of days ago, and edited several others, similar problems in other threads, just need some members to calm down a little.

 

[Finman]

No, no more than many others, Karol, including myself on the odd rare occasion, but things have been getting worse just recently, we have already deleted 76 complete posts from this thread a couple of days ago, and edited several others, similar problems in other threads, just need some members to calm down a little.

Worst winter experiences

 

[maddydog]

Worst winter experiences

= Finnish humour

Sex change = British humour

 

[REDWOOD]

Anyone would think its WWIII not Easter.
We are all equal in the eyes of god, unfortunately some think they are more equal than others

 

[Ely]

I would much rather be doing a networks apprenticeship rather than a degree. A degree teaches you to write essays and pass exams. When you finally get a job you have to start from scratch and learn the job. There is so much bullshit that you don't need on a degree. When did an essay ever help you in life? An apprenticeship teaches you the job, on the job without getting into dept while funding an over priced business and cuts out most of the bullshit that will never be needed used and instantly forgotten once the exam is over. Alas there are no apprenticeships and at 32 I'd be too old anyway so uni was my only option. Over a barrel comes to mind.

 

[Dishmop]

In the 70's the government encouraged kids to stay on at school for further education..Then to get good grades and go to university....so they could get good well paid jobs.

All this was because there wasnt any jobs for them.

Most degrees seem to be a joke anyway.

 

[For want of a better word]

Bring back free university tuition for courses that bring value to the economy, slash university places to 17% and bring back skilled apprenticeships. That would set our economy in the right direction and make it fairer for our youth.

I agree with you KAROL.....
I have experienced the "Traditional apprenticeship" in two very different worlds... medicine.. and engineering.
I have seen my IP exploited with no gain to myself except for the satisfaction that the "idea" has saved a considerable number of lives... you probably may have had one stuck on your finger to monitor your O2 saturation!

On early retirement I took a BSc Honours degree.

Without any "0s or As" the the University would accept... let alone my two HNCs... ( in Medical Laboritory technology and Electronics) I had to complete a year 0 or foundation degree to allow me onto my chosen degree course.

To be honest the degree opened doors... but in truth the HNC qualification done on the tools in real life was a far much more preparation for a working life than the degree....
I am not so supprised that there are so many graduates either unemployed or employed in areas where their subject is totally not utilised.
The lack of University degree ( especially proper degrees from Oxford & Cambridge University) seemed to be the reason used to barr many from reaching higher positions in some of our institutions ( BBC etc).


Yeghes da

 

[Thymallus]

Sorry, I simply had the impression it was normal practise.

 

[Karol]

It's the miss selling by universities that gets me.

My daughter's school held a university open evening for students to help them decide what degree to go for. Part of that was a presentation by one of the admissions tutors about how great university life was. He went on to say that students shouldn't worry about what degree they went for; they should go just for the experience even if it was the degree in Viking studies.

No mention of the £112,000 that would have to be paid back over 22 years for the three year degree in Viking studies based on the current RPI. Didn't bother to show how that figure would change with any increase in RPI.

What he did show however was lovely pictures of the university campus with lots of smiling students basking in warm sunshine. And of course, the accommodation all belongs to the university with accommodation costing £6,000 per annum. Nice captive hotel racket ain't it!

Yes there were alternatives to university says he in a condescending manner brushing it off as the path for low life failures.

The whole thing is a travesty and a scam. If you have any MPs or their minions knocking on your door during the election campaign stick it to them and make it known that this is unacceptable and unfair on our youth.

 

[Tremyfro]

I always thought that getting educated...was just that...learning about the world we live in...how it works....for some students learning was a privilege ...access to untold treasures. To go forward to further education at a college or university and study a subject of choice...something that really interested you and you wanted to learn more about it....what a wonderful chance to be in the company of experts in their own field. For some students...the formality of learning within a school environment was an anathema. They sought their education in different forms...practical, social, hobbies, entrepreneurial. Somewhere...we started to be told that the only way to get a good job...read that as a well paid job....was to do a degree....it didn't matter what degree, as training for the job could be done when you started it. Personally, I don't think any education is wasted...or the time wasted doing it. An education is not about who has the highest IQ ...it is about making yourself a well rounded useful member of your own community. The education might be directly applicable...as in vocational training or it might be practical, as in apprentiship. Some people simply like to push their learning into new areas...inventive.
One thing is for sure...we are all learning all the time. There is always something new or someone else with greater learning and understanding.
Embracing new thought is fundamentally human. It is not the perogative of academia....all of us share it.

 

[Karol]

Sorry, I simply had the impression it was normal practise.

What's normal practice - to fleece students?

 

[Thymallus]

opportunities to improve social mobility to boot by not strangling students with massive debts to fund people like you.

I couldn't agree more with tuition fees. They are big insult and are hated by most lecturers and students alike.
But they were brought in by the last Labour Government at the same time as they slashed the University's operating budget. The hidden agenda behind this was to make higher education self sustaining without public money. The Tories have not seen fit to change it since being in power....so we are stuck with it as neither party has the political will to change things.

Massive debts to fund me!!......As you don't even know me you have no idea how my salary was paid. Nor have you any idea of how low academic salaries are. Don't confuse the University Accountants balancing the books with the grunts on the lab floor working 12/7 on an average day for less money a week that a plumber picks up mending a leaky washer.

 

[Dishmop]

No mention of the £112,000 that would have to be paid back over 22 years for the three year degree in Viking studies based on the current RPI. Didn't bother to show how that figure would change with any increase in RPI.

Not sure where you got that figure.
Ony has to be paid once they start to earn over a certain amount, and if it isnt repaid after so many years the debt is cancelled. Most of student loans dont get repaid.

 

[Thymallus]

What's normal practice - to fleece students?

Nope, I simply understood that it appeared to be normal practice to put the insult to the poster at the end of the mail. Youre one at the beginning was obviously at odds with what appears to be the normal forum insulting policies. ......

 

[Dishmop]

Sorry, I simply had the impression it was normal practise.

confusion in what you are referring to as normal practice.