Too much honey for new queen to lay?

[beekake]

I did a pagden AS on one of my colonies about a month or so ago (14 x 12 frames). The original queen has stayed put, laying like crazy and the bees are storing nectar like crazy. I've already taken 4 supers of OSR off, and they've nearly filled another 3 supers since (the OSR is long over now).

The daughter colony (which was a 14 x 12, plus one super) has been very busy, and they've been bringing in pollen for the last 10 days at least. I added another super last week after finding that the one on there was full of frames that were full of honey and starting to be sealed. I checked the hive fully for the first time today, and the super I added last week is full, the original super is sealed over and the brood box (11 frames) is all honey, dotted with cells with pollen. Not a sign of an egg! Plenty of bees though (there were 11 frames of brood when I did the AS).

A queen cell taken from the daughter colony when I thinned out following the pagden has hatched in a mating nuc, is mated and laying (sealed worker brood).

Is it conceivable that the bees have been so successful at collecting honey while waiting for the queen to hatch and mate that there is no space for her to get started? The bees didn't seem especially agitated when I inspected, nor did I see any of the flappy wing queenless behaviour.

I suppose I could put a test frame in, but I don't have too many jumbo frames of eggs about. Any ideas what I could do next?

 

[irishguy]

I did a pagden AS on one of my colonies about a month or so ago (14 x 12 frames). The original queen has stayed put, laying like crazy and the bees are storing nectar like crazy. I've already taken 4 supers of OSR off, and they've nearly filled another 3 supers since (the OSR is long over now).

The daughter colony (which was a 14 x 12, plus one super) has been very busy, and they've been bringing in pollen for the last 10 days at least. I added another super last week after finding that the one on there was full of frames that were full of honey and starting to be sealed. I checked the hive fully for the first time today, and the super I added last week is full, the original super is sealed over and the brood box (11 frames) is all honey, dotted with cells with pollen. Not a sign of an egg! Plenty of bees though (there were 11 frames of brood when I did the AS).

A queen cell taken from the daughter colony when I thinned out following the pagden has hatched in a mating nuc, is mated and laying (sealed worker brood).

Is it conceivable that the bees have been so successful at collecting honey while waiting for the queen to hatch and mate that there is no space for her to get started? The bees didn't seem especially agitated when I inspected, nor did I see any of the flappy wing queenless behaviour.

I suppose I could put a test frame in, but I don't have too many jumbo frames of eggs about. Any ideas what I could do next?

I think I read the bees will move the honey but don't quote me on it. I'm.waiting on it getting answered in my own thread . I'm not a betting man but Id wager my life on you getting this answered before anyone answers my own . Anyway, what ever the out come, I hope you don't have any problems with it from here on in.

 

[Hivemaker.]

I suppose I could put a test frame in, but I don't have too many jumbo frames of eggs about. Any ideas what I could do next?

Just graft a very small section of comb in containing eggs and tiny larvae.

 

[beekake]

Good idea. Do you think I should also add supers to provide space for them to move the honey around? There is literally not a single cell available in the brood box or in the two supers above.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Do you think I should also add supers to provide space for them to move the honey around? There is literally not a single cell available in the brood box or in the two supers above.

What do you think? maybe that's the reason the combs in the brood box are full of honey. They won't hang around doing nothing until the queen mates. Had a hive last year filled two supers between swarming and the new queen beginning to lay.

 

[beekake]

Yes, that's exactly the same situation. Two supers and a brood box filled with honey in 4 weeks while the new queen mates. I will be adding supers of course, but I've not encountered this situation before, so I don't know how long it'll take for them to move the stuff from downstairs to upstairs. I've got a couple of half drawn jumbo frames that I'll throw in there too.

 

[oliver90owner]

Remember, too, that there was no brood to feed after the new queen should have emerged. 10 frames of 14 x12 equates to an awful lot of worker bees emerging that have had nothing to do other than processing forage, especially if you did not swap the box to the other side of the old queen box after a week (no particular need, if only one queen cell left).

 

[Finman]

.
Hive has been so full that it has swarmed. That is why laying queen is not there any more.

Extract honey that new queen gets free combs to lay. That is how how beekeeping works.

 

[beekake]

Yes, perhaps the new queen has swarmed. I don't know. I have not experienced this before because in all the other times I've done an AS, the bees have never back filled the comb to such an extent that there is no laying room left. I have always followed the method that you leave the supers on the box on the original site, which has always worked out. Of course I am going to try to make some laying space, but this was a bit unexpected and I wanted to get some opinions or info on if others had experienced this kind of thing.

 

[Finman]

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Laying room is not left... That is not problem. You extract combs, and then you have room to lay.

When bees move capped food to another place, they consume 24% from that moved food as working energy. To put them move capped honey makes no sense. Vain work.


.

 

[beekake]

Too right. No point them wasting good honey! My plan is to get back there as soon as I can with some empty brood comb, as well as a couple of drawn supers...not all of the honey is capped, so I'm assuming they will shift that first, if needed. I'm just amazed at the fact that a colony that is requeening has collected around 50kg of honey in just a few weeks. My previous experience is that no income will come in until the queen arrives, but this could be because normally my bees need AS around the time the OSR ends. This time, requeening seems to have coincided with a strong flow (beans and phacelia, I think).

 

[beekake]

Test frame in, drawn frame in, undrawn frame in, and two supers added. Let's see what they make if that!

 

[Hebeegeebee]

Test frame in, drawn frame in, undrawn frame in, and two supers added. Let's see what they make if that!

Excellent.
Too much honey is a nice problem to have!

 

[beekake]

Queen less. They've been busy drawing emergency cells on the test frame, and filling the drawn frame with honey! I've got a queen in a mating mix, so I'm going to put her in when I next get the chance.

Mystery solved.

 

[BeeJayBee]

Queen less. They've been busy drawing emergency cells on the test frame, and filling the drawn frame with honey! I've got a queen in a mating mix, so I'm going to put her in when I next get the chance.

Mystery solved.

That's good news