Queen introduction advice please

[Mel]

I'm expecting a queen in the post this week to introduce to a large colony which has been queenless for about 3 weeks. The colony is now quite ratty - not highly agressive but enough to make me feel uncomfortable about introducing the queen directly in a cage. I thought I would put her in a nuc with brood and nurse bees from another colony. Here's the question = presumably she will fill up the nuc with eggs fairly quickly once she's out of the cage - how best then to unite the nuc and the old colony - which will still be sitting there, queenless? Put them all in a new brood box with the old honey supers and on top? Are they likely to accept the queen and nuc population?
Advice gratefully received

 

[Ian123]

Yes better chances if you introduce her into a nuc, but by the time shes introduced and safe to inspect you are looking at at least a week minimum. Simply make up your nuc in a single brood and do a paper unite once shes up and running...I wonder if your q-less colony will be q-right by then!!!!! are you sure theres not a virgin in there.

 

[eltalia]

As Ian notes... make very sure the colony is queenless, sift through a QX over
a box if necessary.
To introduce make up a flymesh basket that will hold the posted queencage
with airspace gap and sit that between two frames, making sure the cage exit
is towards the bottomboard. That barrier will prevent any aggressive balling
and IF she is released before you can again check they will feed her through
the mesh.

Bill

 

[masterBK]

If there is no virgin in there then the problem of laying workers can arise. The brood pheromone from the unsealed and the sealed brood inhibits activating their ovaries. Once all the brood as emerged (3 weeks after queen removed/died etc) and with no pheromone from queen or brood then some of the workers start developing their vestigial ovaries. Such colonies can sometimes be difficult to requeen even by uniting a nuclei (one of the safest methods)

 

[Finman]

Put first into the hive a frame of larvae and egs. Then you see, does the hive start to rear queen cells. The larva frame calms then a lot.

If they start to rear emergency cells, bees accept a new queen quite easily when their own cells are capped.

There is an idiot sure queen introducing.

- put a fly mesh over the hive. Make a whole box nuc over the mes.
- Take two frames of emerging bees from another hive. Shake all bees off.
- shoot all holes in the nuc, that no bees can come out of come in.
- let the bees emerge upstairs and when they are tens there, put the new queen walk onto combs.
- when the the nuc is over the mesh few day, nuc and the main hive will get same scent.
- then you can join the colonies without paper.
- to make sure that big hived does not kill the queen, put the queen under the push in cage. You see, how bees react on push in cage. If they bite the gage, they want to kill the queen.

 

[Mel]

Thanks very much everyone - all good advice and (mostly!) consistent! Sometimes one just needs to be reminded of the obvious, like making up the nuc in a brood box. I'm pretty sure they are queenless but will sift. 10 days ago ago I saw them swarming out of the hive and settling nicely on a nearby apple tree so I went on digging the veg patch to give them a bit of time - turned round 20 minutes later and they had disappeared from the tree, and judging from the disturbance round the hive they had gone back in again. Odd behaviour. Anyhow, fingers crossed with the new queen.

 

[Finman]

Mel, the swarm did not get a queen with them. They will try again as lonh that they will succeed.

Open the hive and look, what kind of queen cells they have..
.

 

[eltalia]

Mel, I am not getting why it is you are looking at a nuc in this, it's unecessary work
not forgetting the restructure for them in caste - this alone adds a factor of loss.
As to that strange return?
Likely the queen either couldn't or wouldn't be called out, not unusual at all
around an apiary. Not to say she has not left since, only you will know this...
eventually.
Stay on it.


Bill