bee swarm swarm disaster, what to do?

[menteth]

Hello everyone, have been away welding for 2 weeks. Bees fed, and de-mited.
However when returned yesterday, my bees had swarmed (a week ago). My neighbour said he thought it odd that they were out in the pouring rain for 4 days. Wish he'd told me. Anyway, total disaster, just swept up a bucket of dead bees. Heartbroken. The miserable summer must have confused them.

The advice I need is this (please): I opened the hive, It is queenless. The hive is of course much weakened. Can I introduce a new queen (would be the easiest)? Is it too late to do that? And, if so, does anyone have one for me?

Any advice would be great

Thanks

 

[VEG]

To be honest it is probably too late to put another queen in there. Most colonies are now rearing the bees that will see them through the winter. If there is no brood in the hive and you put a new queen in there it will be 21 days before any new brood hatched, this will not allow enough winter bees to be reared. You can combine them with the hive you have.
Were there any queen cells in the hive open or torn open?

 

[dpearce4]

Sorry to hear your news.

I personally would make sure there is no queen in there by putting a test frame in from your other hive, see if they make queen cells, if they do then i would remove the cells then unite with the other hive.

If they dont then look and see if there are any eggs on other frames if there are then leave, if not then try and find the new queen (she wont get mated well this time of year i would think), remove her then again unite with your other hive.

you would then have a nice strong hive going into winter and if you work on the spring build up you should be able to split them in the spring to give you a couple of strong colonies for next year.

 

[Outlander]

Hi really sorry to hear that you have lost your bees. From reading a lot of posts on the forum of people who say that they have queenless hives, the general advice is to make sure you don't gave a queen in there first. are you sure there is not a virgin. If not try and find a mated queen. If there is a virgin it's unlikely she will mate now so squash and again try to find mated queen. Good luck.

PS. What would be the chances of them making it through winter with a virgin and if so would she mate early enough. Just a thought

 

[northernsoul]

I don't understand why there were dead bees?

Natural swarming is about increasing bees and colonies not bees dying.
Are you sure the colony didn't just die off?
If this is the case you need to know why they died.

 

[beeno]

Hello everyone, have been away welding for 2 weeks. Bees fed, and de-mited.
However when returned yesterday, my bees had swarmed (a week ago). My neighbour said he thought it odd that they were out in the pouring rain for 4 days. Wish he'd told me. Anyway, total disaster, just swept up a bucket of dead bees. Heartbroken. The miserable summer must have confused them.

The advice I need is this (please): I opened the hive, It is queenless. The hive is of course much weakened. Can I introduce a new queen (would be the easiest)? Is it too late to do that? And, if so, does anyone have one for me?

Any advice would be great

Thanks

Hi menteth,
Tradgic - what else can be said. Hope you can salvage something from the situation. The season ain't over and the bees don't always know what they are doing! Best of luck!

 

[bee ginnner]

sorry to hear about your bee,s menteth. personally i would combine the remains, there shoudn't be a queen in there and any virgins would be too late i would think especially if the weather stays as it is.

OUTLANDER a virgin needs to mate within a few weeks and would be no good if unmated till the spring.

 

[PBee]

If they swarmed it would be very unusual for a virgin not to be present in the parent hive. You will have to find her before you either combine or requeen.

 

[itma]

... my bees had swarmed (a week ago).
... I opened the hive, It is queenless. The hive is of course much weakened. Can I introduce a new queen (would be the easiest)? Is it too late to do that? And, if so, does anyone have one for me?
...

If they swarmed, I'd be interested to find out why.
It might have an impact on what to do next.
Is the hive rammed full of stores? Or empty?


You say its queenless. How are you sure?
You need to be *certain* before introducing a new queen!
Lack of unsealed brood does not mean that there's no virgin at home!

If you were to introduce someone else's mated (surplus) queen today, then you'd have a brood break of (hopefully) less than two weeks.
I wouldn't think of that as a dramatic winter-bee brood-break. Not good, but not automatically disastrous.

My concern would be more about the number of remaining bees and whether or not they were likely to be able to raise enough additional winter bees (brood warming/nursing) to get a colony through the winter in a full hive.
I suspect that taking them down to overwinter in a (poly?) nuc might be an option deserving serious consideration.
Either that or combining ...

 

[meidel]

If you do find a queen in the hive don't despair that it might be a virgin - I had one emerge 12 days ago in a poly nuc and saw her go out and come back from mating flights yesterday. Whether or not she lays and the brood is going to survive through winter is another matter, but I'm leaving them alone to see what happens next year. There were 2 frames of BIAS in the polynuc when they were started in early September. The foragers were bees which returned to the "homing" spot after their hive had been given to another beekeeper who sited them less than 3 miles away.

 

[justme]

I don't understand why there were dead bees?

Natural swarming is about increasing bees and colonies not bees dying.
Are you sure the colony didn't just die off?
If this is the case you need to know why they died.

presumed I would say, they took a chance in a small weather window but never got another chance to rehome themselves. Seems that neighbour had seen them outside for 4 days so that makes sense.

 

[menteth]

Hi everyone, thanks v much for posts.
very useful.
Seems that I may have to do some sort of unite.
I'm going to have a good look today for a queen (didn't see one yesterday, but it was getting dark and cold, so I had to hurry).
I will also have a good look for eggs.
I did have a good look yesterday for queen cells. None at all. Not even cups.
So I'm pretty sure there'll be no virgin.
Still a fair amount of bees inside, though that is (i am well aware) a meaningless statement.
They're pretty moody, which I suppose is a result of having no queen.
How long do I have to do a unite?
Thanks

 

[Poly Hive]

I would strongly suggest you use a test frame to make SURE this colony is Q-

After establishing that then consider uniting to your good one.

It is possible that your swar was a reaction to a varroa load. You may want to check the situation re the mite drop.

PH

 

[Outlander]

sorry to hear about your bee,s menteth. personally i would combine the remains, there shoudn't be a queen in there and any virgins would be too late i would think especially if the weather stays as it is.

OUTLANDER a virgin needs to mate within a few weeks and would be no good if unmated till the spring.

Oh I should have known that, shouldn’t I. Oh well I do now.

Then it's combine then.

 

[oliver90owner]

It is possible that your swar was a reaction to a varroa load.

Or perhaps the old queen gone after a 'superdcedure' and taken a few bees with her?

All possibilities, and uniting with a virgin in there would likely give rise to further angst.