An unpleasant smell

[Skyhook]

Fed the bees this afternoon. I have one Pains poly, which has the miller type feeder with no cover over the centre section. When I took the roof off, there was a faint but unpleasant odour, a bit like when a mouse dies under the floor.

I'm now worried that this could be foul brood. I understand they can both smell bad- AFB due to the effects of the disease, EFB due to the effects of secondary decay. There have been no cases of AFB reported in my area this year, but it is an EFB area.

I intend to inspect tomorrow. Who knows, I may even find a dead mouse in the hive!

Does EFB have a seasonal pattern? Can anyone suggest any other possible causes?

Background- fairly strong colony built up this year from nuc with June queen from Norton. Bad varroa infection- started thymol on 7/9, then when they threw out all their brood, removed thymol and treated with OA on 26/9. By 6/10 there was ELB on 2 frames. I started feeding thymolated 2:1, and have been feeding since., in which time they've taken about 15L. Mite drop currently 1-2/day.

.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

dead damp bees on the floor which haven't been cleared out?

 

[For want of a better word]

Was the feed thymolated... if not possibly fermenting?

Tho generally that smells like mould not mouse.

 

[PBee]

Fed the bees this afternoon. I have one Pains poly, which has the miller type feeder with no cover over the centre section. When I took the roof off, there was a faint but unpleasant odour, a bit like when a mouse dies under the floor.

I'm now worried that this could be foul brood. I understand they can both smell bad- AFB due to the effects of the disease, EFB due to the effects of secondary decay. There have been no cases of AFB reported in my area this year, but it is an EFB area.

I intend to inspect tomorrow. Who knows, I may even find a dead mouse in the hive!

Does EFB have a seasonal pattern? Can anyone suggest any other possible causes?


Background- fairly strong colony built up this year from nuc with June queen from Norton. Bad varroa infection- started thymol on 7/9, then when they threw out all their brood, removed thymol and treated with OA on 26/9. By 6/10 there was ELB on 2 frames. I started feeding thymolated 2:1, and have been feeding since., in which time they've taken about 15L. Mite drop currently 1-2/day.

.

Would there possibly be some of the dead brood from the treatment somewhere that have decayed?

 

[itma]

Fingers crossed for you.

There's a FERA document on 'brood diseases' (akin to 'Managing Varroa') and it is also available for download from https://secure.fera.defra.gov.uk/beebase/index.cfm?pageid=167
Some very useful diagnostic photos in there.

One important take-away from the RBI/SBI disease workshop I attended earlier in the year was to really shake the combs clear of bees before the careful inspecting required.
But at this time of the year, you're going to have to be careful with HMQ.

I hope you discover an innocuous source for that smell.

 

[Skyhook]

Thanks guys. The syrup is thymolised so shouldn't go off. The combs were empty after thymol, so I think they'd got everything, but I intend to check, and I will take a look at the floor while I'm at it.

There were a few dead bees on top of the feeder (looked drowned), but I wouldn't have thought there were enough to smell.

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[REDWOOD]

Ivy

 

[Suzi Q]

Noo, ivy smells pleasant, not like a dead mouse! My cat brings in mice, looses them under the sofa, and hey presto a dead mouse smell. It ain't like the smell of a hive with bees working the ivy!

 

[REDWOOD]

Would there possibly be some of the dead brood from the treatment somewhere that have decayed?

I just need some place where I can lay my head
Proverbs 18:2
A fool takes no pleasure in understanding,
but only in expressing his opinion

 

[MuswellMetro]

EFB smells because of secondary infection but AFB doesn't normally as the bacteria produces a toxin that kill the secondary bacteria

but if you have the varroa board in , then i suspect damp because the bees are still evaporating syrup and the water will condense on the coldest part of the hive...thin varroa floor that is covered in dross

 

[Skyhook]

Investigated today, and found nothing amiss- Eggs and BIAS on 5 frames, larvae pearly white and lying as they should, decent pattern of capped brood. The only thing wrong was 2 cells of chalkbrood, but I can live with that if they can. So as long as I haven't chilled the brood while inspecting, all is well.

I suspect it may just have been the drowned bees that the others had pulled out of the syrup, staying moist and smelly because of the lack of air circulation above the feeder.

The only thing I saw and which I often see was a few cells with a hole nibbled or worn in the capping (in cells not ready to emerge) This has never seemed to overly worry the inspector, but I'm not sure why it is like that.