Varroa heads up!

[midnight sun]

Mainly for the very new keepers really.
Checked my colonies for Varroa yesterday as a routine and found quite a heavy 'natural' drop in 24 hrs. Surprising as they were treated with MAQS at the end of July.
Oxalic vaporized today with good instant drop.
Weather is keeping brooding going around here so I suggest you check your hives for varroa, just in case it has slipped your mind.
Regards

 

[Apple]

Varroa and the dreadful viral diseases they transmit should never be far from any beekeepers mind.
That is one reason I am not in favor of importing bees into the British Isles!
Too easy for a bee Ebola to get here with the tens of thousands of bees we needlessly import.
Possible controversial, but that is my thought.


James

 

[Hivemaker.]

Surprising as they were treated with MAQS at the end of July.

I'm not surprised.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'm not surprised.

 

[TOBY-3652]

I'm not surprised.

 

[Jimmy]

Why the lack of surprise?

 

[Erichalfbee]

I have four colonies that were treated with MAQS on July 5th.
Two got one strip only and I have had to treat again. They have dropped thousands of mites.
Two got two strips and as there was a natural mite drop of zero monitored over a month they got no further treatment.
I plan to oxalic all the colonies the weekend after Christmas. I will bookmark this thread and report the post Tx drops.

Oxalic vaporized today with good instant drop.
Weather is keeping brooding going around here

Would Apivar have been a better choice?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

Why the lack of surprise?

Do you think the surviving mites (and survive they will) were going to sit twiddling their thumbs for the rest of the summer - bees were brooding furiously well after july - ipso factoso would the mites - the earlier you treat, the sonner they build up again

 

[Jimmy]

Thanks JBM. I've had the same issue as the OP and erichalfbee. I treated with Maqs in July as I made some late August nucs with new queens and wanted to avoid treating at the same time. I thought I'd be OK until a winter oxalic trickle but the mite counts last weekend have forced my hand.

 

[oliver90owner]

I thought I'd be OK until a winter oxalic trickle but the mite counts last weekend have forced my hand.

Flawed. Winter oxalic does little or nothing for winter survival - it just starts the new season with a low mite count. Winter bees infected with lots of varroa-sourced viruses is a main problem of winter survival. Think through it carefully and that conclusion must be very clear. Avoidance of pathogens in the winter bees is far better than them living with (and dying of) them throughout the winter months.

 

[Erichalfbee]

To late to protect those winter bees alas

 

[itma]

Do you think the surviving mites (and survive they will) were going to sit twiddling their thumbs for the rest of the summer - bees were brooding furiously well after july - ipso factoso would the mites - the earlier you treat, the sonner they build up again

That shouldn't be an argument for delaying treatment.

Untreated, they would have built up enormously.

If you find a lot of mites in July, June, whenever, it would be a mistake to wait until August or September before doing something about it.
The idea of "Integrated Pest Management" is to keep the blighters at a low level. And do something about it if they get beyond your threshold.

Where MAQS comes in is as being something you can do to make a significant impact on the mites while there is honey on the hive.
Its not the answer to the maiden's prayer, it is just one more weapon in your armoury.

Much better to treat early, if you have a problem, rather than waiting for the problem to build up to catastrophic proportions.
But it would be a different kind of mistake to think that, having treated with MAQS in mid-season, that was varroa over and done with until Christmas.

 

[midnight sun]

I'm not surprised.

Yes, Although it is only about 7 weeks since the treatment ended, they have built up to high levels faster than I anticipated. (note to self:must keep a closer eye on this in the future)
As a further point, a few I have spoken to are not that impressed with MAQS as they say it is not as effective as they thought. ( I am too really if I'm honest, perhaps I expected too much from it, like some 'miracle cure' ).
I'd appreciate your (or any other interested parties obviously) feedback on this.
Regards

 

[Hivemaker.]

As a further point, a few I have spoken to are not that impressed with MAQS as they say it is not as effective as they thought.

I have also spoken with others that have the same experience, and there are still a lot of mites left alive under the cappings, more so in the drone brood, and even worse when treating with open mesh floors, even the male mites. It is not easy to kill these mites under cappings with formic, i found this out myself, a long time ago.

 

[Eyeman]

As a further point, a few I have spoken to are not that impressed with MAQS as they say it is not as effective as they thought. ( I am too really if I'm honest, perhaps I expected too much from it, like some 'miracle cure' ).

Take a look at the technique you use before knocking the product. There seems to be a lot of modifications being suggests on how MAQS should be applied. I'm no expert, but after applying MAQS I like to see either or both a nice bearding at the entrance or evidence of a break in the queens laying when checking a week later. I suspect some are not getting the concentration of Formic acid high enough to get the mites under the capped brood.
Using MAQS in July means I don't have a mite problem come September so when the honey comes off the bees they can concentrate on building up their stores and numbers for winter. When I used to use Apiguard after the honey came off, the activity of the bees were checked for a month before the queen started laying properly again.

 

[Jimmy]

Using MAQS in July means I don't have a mite problem come September .

Have you checked? I treated in July, effectively according to your criteria, and now appear to have a mite problem.

If it's say 95% effective with only 5% of the mites surviving given the size of the colony in July that will still be a large number of mites with which to start the next generation.
Itma's last sentence is pertinent - 'But it would be a different kind of mistake to think that, having treated with MAQS in mid-season, that was varroa over and done with until Christmas'.

 

[Apple]

I thought I'd be OK until a winter oxalic trickle but the mite counts last weekend have forced my hand.

Flawed. Winter oxalic does little or nothing for winter survival - it just starts the new season with a low mite count. Winter bees infected with lots of varroa-sourced viruses is a main problem of winter survival. Think through it carefully and that conclusion must be very clear. Avoidance of pathogens in the winter bees is far better than them living with (and dying of) them throughout the winter months.

Well said that man!

However my own experience with the use of formic acid has left me with something of the same taste in my mouth as the dreadful winter trickle of dilute oxallic acid, with the forlorn hope of getting every last mite in the colony.

I have yet to have had to do it, but can I ask the question , of all those so much more experienced in squirting and fumigating, why can oxallic acid not be used whilst there remains honey in the hive??

After all it is merely concentrated rhubarb juice!!


James

 

[itma]

…
Itma's last sentence is pertinent - 'But it would be a different kind of mistake to think that, having treated with MAQS in mid-season, that was varroa over and done with until Christmas'.

I really should have said "… it would be a different kind of mistake to think that, having treated with MAQS in mid-season, that was varroa over and done with for certain until Christmas" …

Always makes sense to check a while after treatment - whatever the treatment - to get an idea of the amount of problem remaining.
Plenty folk report occasional ineffectual Thymol (eg Apiguard) treatments … usually attributed to the weather or some other uncontrollable cause. I even know of one beekeeper who is certain (though I am not) that his varroa are resistant to Thymol …

 

[itma]

… I have yet to have had to do it, but can I ask the question , of all those so much more experienced in squirting and fumigating, why can oxallic acid not be used whilst there remains honey in the hive??

After all it is merely concentrated rhubarb juice!!

Oxalic Acid treatment doesn't reach varroa in brood cells.
Plus its ordinarily a single shot (unlike Thymol being there for a month and more).
So the thing (for effectiveness) is not to use it when there is brood in the hive.


IIRC, the Oxalic in Rhubarb is principally in the leaves - which is why we don't eat them. But maybe you do?

 

[chipper]

Ineffective Apiguard treatment ? The floors need to be solid and the entrance reduced.....
And the dose appropriate to the size of the brood box....

Oxalic trickle method ONLY highly effective in a broodless period...
Though I know some who use it as an emergency treatment in the summer if bad varroa damage is evident