Turning crystallised honey into soft set

[jackstraw]

Ive made a honey warming cabinet, bought an STC1000 and have my 25b bucket of crystallised honey ready to turn into soft set
What temperature should I heat it to and for how long to turn it into runny honey so I can add the seed
Thanks

 

[SixFooter]

I asked this question not long ago ang got unhelpful answers of as low as possible etc...
If you google honey temperatures, you will find a few answers. I chose 32 deg for 2 days which seemed to work and no one died.

 

[drex]

Keeping the temp as low as possible is right, but last year I had to take one batch up to 45 to get it to melt. I would not go above that except for very short time.

 

[Davelin]

I heat at about 35C.

Give it a stir after 24hrs.

How long? until it's all clear!

 

[itma]

You need to get rid of ALL the crystals.

Mine has been getting 44C for a couple of days, stirred at least 3x per 24 hours. (Hint: have a spare bucket ready for your stirrer!)
Then I strain it while warm through a 250 micron filter, and leave it to sit quietly for a couple of hours at room temperature, while the jars of seed go into the warming cabinet, set at 30C.
/// Even after this heating and stirring, the strainer does remove some crystals ... which is why I think warm fine straining is useful.

After the runny honey is definitely below 30C, the seed can be added and the batch mixed to uniformity.
Then its a matter of keeping it cool and frequently stirred until you think its setting (depends on your honey), when you need to get it into jars before it goes too solid! (Warming again to 30C - if needs be - should make it fluid enough to jar, if it is SOFT set ...)


/// Should have said that my "warming cabinet" (spare polyhive) has a fan to circulate and even out the warmth, but even so, to measure a typical average temperature within the cabinet, I arrange the temperature sensor to be about an inch away from the side of the bucket and about half way up the bucket (by simply looping the wire around the bucket handle!)
All this means that the temperature the STC1000 sees is as close as possible to reality.
Warming times in a waterbath (tea urn) can be much quicker than using warm air.

 

[Erichalfbee]

Warm to 40˚ for a couple of days.
Cool to 30 ish but this isn't critical as long as it's below.
Add seed and mix thoroughly without introducing air, one of those corkscrew honey stirrers is ideal.
When thoroughly mixed I jar straightaway and keep the jars in the garage as near 12-15˚ as possible.
Always works for me.
Remember to keep a few jars of the seed back for next time.

 

[itma]

My 'setting' honey isn't OSR. And its a bit slow to set. Even stays a bit runny. Very soft set.
I'm reluctant to jar it too soon, otherwise I fear I'd be seeing separation.
But if it was kwikset OSR, then I could understand wanting to get it into jars with a minimum of delay!

 

[Erichalfbee]

My 'setting' honey isn't OSR.
.....................................................................................
But if it was kwikset OSR, then I could understand wanting to get it into jars with a minimum of delay!

Neither is mine but it seems to set OK in about four days as long as it's kept cool enough I guess.

 

[bpmurray]

I'm very naive about this so please excuse my stupid question. I understand how all this is done with the exception of where do you get the seed - is it a chicken-egg thing?

 

[jackstraw]

Many thanks

Many thanks for your replies, really useful information and much appreciated
I have a 1lb jar to seed so first 9lb's have been warmed and stirred. Shall be mixing in the seed in a couple of days
Kind regards
Jack

 

[Ely]

If you have done all of your steps and made soft set and it has fully set in a bucket, what temperature would it be OK to reheat and jar without ruining the soft set quality? I reheated some honey that was just beginning to crystallise last year (wasn't soft set just crystallised) at 40 degrees for around 24 hours and it is still runny. It has stayed runny for a much longer duration after heating than the initial period

 

[itma]

I'm very naive about this so please excuse my stupid question. I understand how all this is done with the exception of where do you get the seed - is it a chicken-egg thing?

The simplest way is to get (buy/swap) a small jar of the smoothest soft set honey you can find from among your local beekeeping pals. And use that 8oz to seed 3 or 4 pounds of your honey, which will then give you enough to seed a bucketful, and you are on your way. And only about 1/60th of your first bucket wouldn't be "all your own work".
Of course you could use a teaspoonful of bought-in to seed a small jar of your own - doing the extra step, reduces the amount of bought-in but adds to the faff.
Maybe you'd choose that route if you had to use commercial honey as your seed.

Or you could take some of your own rough-set honey and grind it (with a pestle and mortar) until it is smooth enough for your liking. This is the slow and potentially messy (though most ethical) way of getting your seed honey!

 

[itma]

If you have done all of your steps and made soft set and it has fully set in a bucket, what temperature would it be OK to reheat and jar without ruining the soft set quality?

30C for just long enough to soften should be OK.

I reheated some honey that was just beginning to crystallise last year (wasn't soft set just crystallised) at 40 degrees for around 24 hours and it is still runny. It has stayed runny for a much longer duration after heating than the initial period

I've observed this too.
The phenomenon seems to be real, but I've not seen an explanation of it.
Perhaps with time the enzyme Glucose Oxidase has reduced the amount of glucose so that it is less super-saturated and so less 'wanting' to crystallise out?
The enzymes would likely be very much more active at 40C than at say 20C.

 

[Ely]

That sounds pretty interesting although I am not too clued up on my chemistry. I'm just glad it doesn't effect the flavour. It is a handy trait to stop it crystallising too soon on shop shelves (without heating at too high a temperature damaging delicate flavours that makes our honey unique and valuable)

 

[Jack Straw]

Creating soft set honey - a couple more q's

The advice has been spot on so far, I have followed it carefully.
I warmed a tub of 9lbs of solid honey to 45 degrees for 2 days turning it into runny honey.

Once the temp had reduced I added a 1lb jar of soft set supplied by a beek from my local association. Sirred this in thoroughly when added and a couple of times for the next two days. The honey is thickening slightly but no way would it pass the 'turn it upside down and it'll stay in the jar' test

My two questions are:

Can I stop stirring now or will I get better results if I continue stirring until it is set?

The 10lbs of soft set I am creating is going to be the seed for my main batch - I have a further 40lbs of solid honey which I should like to give the soft set treatment, jar and sell. When would the 10lb's of soft set I mixed on 5th April be ready to use as the seed for my next batch. Do I need to wait for the complete process to be completed?

Many thanks

 

[BeeJayBee]

Can I stop stirring now or will I get better results if I continue stirring until it is set?

Just bumping your question, whilst at the same time idly wondering what would happen if you try to stir set honey. How much air would it introduce?

 

[user 6228]

be careful using polystyrene as a warming cabinet as it softens at 100C. Note A heater can cause a hot spot with high temperatures immediately above it.
PIR has a higher temperature tolerance

 

[steve1958]

My Honey creamer mixes the honey for 15 minutes every 2 hours for a total of 48 hours

 

[hedgehog66]

My Honey creamer mixes the honey for 15 minutes every 2 hours for a total of 48 hours

Do you not let her sleep ??????
Thats cruel

 

[Thymallus]

You need to get rid of ALL the crystals.

Have you ever used the honey creamers that are like a potato masher? Not the attach to drill types, which always seem to introduce too much air.
I rarely let set honey become totally liquid when reheating. As long as I can mash it with one these beasts I end up with a lovely creamed honey, no crystals left by tongue test (as broken up by the mashing) and it stays soft and creamy for ....well a long long time. Takes about 24 hours at 40oC (longer for some rape honeys) plus 10 minutes of solid mashing ....but all good exercise.
My customers seem to love it.