Swarmed queen's laying rate.

[Putnamsmif]

Just a point of interest really. I collected a late swarm and put them in a poly nuc and donated a frame of capped/ just emerging brood from another hive. I am going to have to put them into a poly national as they are still drawing comb like crazy - 5 frames of foundation drawn pretty much in 3 weeks.

What factors influence the queen's laying rate? I would imagine the obvious one being temperature she should be starting to slow down, but could she ignore the temperature and lay faster than normal at this time of year? I'm also presuming hours of daylight may affect laying rate, is that a reasonable assumption? Then there's available forage - plenty of ivy in the woods near the hive.

I suppose what I'm trying to get at, in a roundabout way, is can the queen ignore the environmental factors such as temperature, hours of daylight, and increase her laying rate at will, or is it entirely driven by these environmental factors? Any research on this?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

It's not the queen that decides - it's the workers: They control the laying rate and probably would encourage her to lay more to populate the hive. However, if there's a shortage of pollen and nectar - they will slow her down

 

[Putnamsmif]

I suppose it stands to reason really as they decide whether she's up to scratch or not. How do they regulate her then? By the amount of food they give her? Or by the number of prepared cells?

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

bit of both probably, plus they can clear out any eggs superfluous to requirement

 

[REDWOOD]

Strains of honey bees; some will and some won't. example, buckfast will fill every available cell on 14x12 frames, other bees won't, I'm not saying your bees do or don't but some strains/breeds will every time.

 

[Putnamsmif]

When I transferred to them to the national poly on Sunday noticed no eggs or brood, just 6 brood frames of stores. Presuming the queen was lost or damaged or killed when I collected them. However they seem extremely happy and considering their presumed queen less state exceptionally calm.

Can I buy in a mated queen at this late stage? I don't want to risk combining them with one of my other colonies because they are at my new apiary site which is where I'm having to move all my hives for next Spring.

First swarm I ever collected so am at a bit of a loss. Are they doomed? Or is there something I could do?

 

[Elaine]

I wouldn't right them off - the queen may well be there. GIve them a chance, and see what happens isn the spring.

 

[Putnamsmif]

Thanks Elaine, I was erring on the side of not really anything else I can do.

 

[oliver90owner]

Presuming sometimes apparently works. There are far better strategies, like observation.

First question for you. Was it a prime or cast?

I'm now presuming you have not checked them for brood until now?

I presume you are aware of how long it may take for a virgin to get mated? Apply that informationto this colony.

Ask yourself how long it takes for a mated queen to return to laying after swarming.

All these questions and answers may lead you to the conclusion that it was likely a cast (easily confirmed by checking for brood after three or four days), there is a queen present and she will start laying sooner or later. Question then will be 'Has she been mated? I will leave that one for you to ponder.

 

[Putnamsmif]

Presuming Ed... that's my nickname.

I've not collected a swarm before but there were a lot of bees - enough to pretty much fill a poly-nuc so I presumed - perhaps wrongly - it was a prime swarm and they would therefore have a laying queen. I honestly don't know how long a swarmed queen would take to start laying. A week maybe? I would hazard a guess it's pretty variable from queen to queen? From almost straight away if they've got drawn comb to a week or even more maybe? You presume correctly Rab that I haven't checked them before Sunday since I first collected them on the 9th of September. I hived them, had them in my garden for a couple of days just because I wasn't sure of I where I was going to put them, then took them to their current location and pretty much left them to it.

Now, presuming again, it may have been a large cast, I guess I can only ponder on when, or if, she will get mated and wait til the Spring to see the result of all this presuming.

Thanks.

 

[sharonh]

Hi,
Why don't you try a test frame from one of your other hives.
At least if they make attempts at building emergency q cells, you ll know they need a queen. If they do, then you can unite with queen right colony.

 

[sharonh]

Presuming Ed... that's my nickname.

I've not collected a swarm before but there were a lot of bees - enough to pretty much fill a poly-nuc so I presumed - perhaps wrongly - it was a prime swarm and they would therefore have a laying queen. I honestly don't know how long a swarmed queen would take to start laying. A week maybe? I would hazard a guess it's pretty variable from queen to queen? From almost straight away if they've got drawn comb to a week or even more maybe? You presume correctly Rab that I haven't checked them before Sunday since I first collected them on the 9th of September. I hived them, had them in my garden for a couple of days just because I wasn't sure of I where I was going to put them, then took them to their current location and pretty much left them to it.

Now, presuming again, it may have been a large cast, I guess I can only ponder on when, or if, she will get mated and wait til the Spring to see the result of all this presuming.

Thanks.

If a cast, she may not be laying yet. I had one this year that took 34 days .i was getting worried also but bees were calm so tried a test frame. Hey presto, it kicked started her into lay & since has well made up with numbers.

 

[Putnamsmif]

Thanks Sharon. I'm just a bit concerned it's a bit late to be messing about with my other 2 colonies.

 

[sharonh]

Thanks Sharon. I'm just a bit concerned it's a bit late to be messing about with my other 2 colonies.

Yes I understand. I don't open mine up this time of Year either.
If they are still calm & no laying workers, it's likely there may be a queen in there.
As I said above, I waited 34 days for one queen to get going.
Don't right them off just yet.