Breeding Groups

[Brian Bush]

[/Quote]My addition to this thread entitled "BREEDING GROUPS", to be fair and reasonable , was to point out that BIBBA has breeding groups throughout the UK, dedicated to bee improvement.
We have a few Breeding Groups here in Cornwall that are using our Native Cornish variant of Amm
Is there some sort of problem with that?[/QUOTE]
No There is no problem. Your local breeding groups, whatever breed, are to be welcomed. The real crux of the matter is whether you are scientifically keeping records, ensuring the purity of the strain, providing breeding queens with pedigrees and supporting performance data going back several years? If the answer to these is yes then I applaud your efforts. But don't you think, however, that you may have something to learn from the experience of others? How are you ensuring that mating takes place within the strain. If it is open mating how do you control the input of non-pure drones? How do you ensure that the drone mother is up to standard? Do you use II or isolated Islands? Explain your policies and routines. Make them open to scrutiny. Don't be so defensive. If your program is successful then extol your success and admit your failures.

 

[For want of a better word]

My addition to this thread entitled "BREEDING GROUPS", to be fair and reasonable , was to point out that BIBBA has breeding groups throughout the UK, dedicated to bee improvement.
We have a few Breeding Groups here in Cornwall that are using our Native Cornish variant of Amm
Is there some sort of problem with that?[/QUOTE]
No There is no problem. Your local breeding groups, whatever breed, are to be welcomed. The real crux of the matter is whether you are scientifically keeping records, ensuring the purity of the strain, providing breeding queens with pedigrees and supporting performance data going back several years? If the answer to these is yes then I applaud your efforts. But don't you think, however, that you may have something to learn from the experience of others? How are you ensuring that mating takes place within the strain. If it is open mating how do you control the input of non-pure drones? How do you ensure that the drone mother is up to standard? Do you use II or isolated Islands? Explain your policies and routines. Make them open to scrutiny. Don't be so defensive. If your program is successful then extol your success and admit your failures.[/QUOTE]

Yes to all of the above
Records of trials, with a lineage of queens ( I do not like the term pedigree!)
Isolated mating..... and drone flooding
University of Plymouth and B4 DNA analyses now on line ( and for previous seasons) with correlation to morphological values.

I use II and this June / July we have BIBBA breeding group members learning the method.
We try to ensure beekeepers within my "isolated" area are keeping Amm.... often giving out queens that will produce quality drones.... although I suspect apiary vicinity mating is the norm for the Cornish variant of Amm.

Last season "stripey" colonies were requeened with Amm queens.

Possibly easier to do this in an area that is predominately native bees, we try to encourage beekeepers in Cornwall to use the local stock... but not all are convinced!

When I lived in Surrey I kept Italian Hybrids...... I still do but in an area to the North East of me( well away from the Amms) where there is a beekeeper who will have none of this native bee nonsence!!... and requeens with imported exotics every year ... if he needs to or not!!
(Does not get as much honey as us on all accounts)

We pulled the plug on the BBKA MB breeders module as I expect as with PW they would have failed us for much the same reasons!!

 

[B+.]

Records of trials, with a lineage of queens ( I do not like the term pedigree!)
Isolated mating..... and drone flooding

Where are they? In a vault? Why aren't they available for viewing?
What do these records show? Are they standard tests that make them comparable with other queens (lines NOT individuals because individual comparisons mean little). Can you tell me why they mean little? No? Its because you are comparing phenotypes and the environment impacts on every colonies performance/behaviour. Where are these comparable tests? I'd like to check them against my records and I'm sure other members of the forum would like to see them too.

"Isolated" by what? A hedge?

 

[B+.]

I use II

Since when? You've asked me basic questions that make it obvious you've never actually done it.

How do you control your drones?

 

[SDM]

"Isolated" by what? A hedge?

ROFL !
The great Tamar rift and a flight of fancy no doubt !

 

[For want of a better word]

Here we go again!

 

[For want of a better word]

Since when? You've asked me basic questions that make it obvious you've never actually done it.

How do you control your drones?

From your replies it would appear you haven't had a great deal of successes either.

 

[B+.]

From your replies it would appear you haven't had a great deal of successes either.

So, as usual, you deflect instead of answering questions .
These questions wont go away. It just makes it clear to everyone that you're full of hot air or, as others have said, a faker.
I've had it with your trolling carp Icanhopit. Its time you realised that we're wise to your lies
My credibility isn't up for debate here, but yours is.

 

[Beefriendly]

I've had it with your trolling carp Icanhopit. Its time you realised that we're wise to your lies
My credibility isn't up for debate here, but yours is.

Well said that man. Glad someone else has also twigged his trolling.

 

[For want of a better word]

Paul
We had a dialogue about antibiotic availability in the UK ( Gentamycin) for use in II
We discussed insemination needles... Abelo could not supply so I purchased direct from Schley.
My bees seem to be able to mate later in the season than yours..... Amc all over by May... Amm just starting!

Hot air... seems there is a cold blast coming from the East!

 

[For want of a better word]

Well said that man. Glad someone else has also twigged his trolling.

Give it up Beefriendly .. you have already been exposed as the banned Thymallarse the Troll of all time!!


about time for the mods to clean up this trash!

 

[SDM]

Careful what you wish for Cheers!
Now back to answering the questions put to you.

 

[B+.]

Paul
We had a dialogue about antibiotic availability in the UK ( Gentamycin) for use in II
We discussed insemination needles... Abelo could not supply so I purchased direct from Schley.
My bees seem to be able to mate later in the season than yours..... Amc all over by May... Amm just starting!

Hot air... seems there is a cold blast coming from the East!

Actually, it has more to do with coordinating mature drone availability with the production of virgin queens.
I don't use antibiotics but most of the recipes seem to include them. Thats why we spoke about antibiotics .

 

[Brian Bush]

Cheers, 2 of your aliases have been exposed in the last 24 hours. Why do you bother to troll? I am heartily sick of it. If you have nothing positive and sensible to add to a discussion just read it and let it alone.
B+ is a very knowledgeable guy who is striving to help his fellow beekeepers in his association. He has managed to get agreement for an association bee improvement group despite entrenched opposition from the committee members who now have to come to terms with the members deciding the way forward.
As a fellow ' bee breeder' you should celebrating this successful first step and offering support, based on your own experiences to others on the forum. Your recent posts contribute nothing and just ensure that good news and advice get lost in a torrent of rubbish comments.

 

[mbc]

Cheers, 2 of your aliases have been exposed in the last 24 hours. Why do you bother to troll? I am heartily sick of it. If you have nothing positive and sensible to add to a discussion just read it and let it alone.
B+ is a very knowledgeable guy who is striving to help his fellow beekeepers in his association. He has managed to get agreement for an association bee improvement group despite entrenched opposition from the committee members who now have to come to terms with the members deciding the way forward.
As a fellow ' bee breeder' you should celebrating this successful first step and offering support, based on your own experiences to others on the forum. Your recent posts contribute nothing and just ensure that good news and advice get lost in a torrent of rubbish comments.

This is a forum, not a place for a monologue but somewhere to exchange ideas and different views.
Your two posts have added nothing but criticism of any dialogue, pot calling the kettle black methinks.
Fwiw I think any attempt to improve our bees and spread knowledge should be applauded, my issue is more with the bombastic style denigrating all others, which I'm sure will kill off any longer term cooperative project lead by such a character. I don't know the man personally but would like to offer heartfelt advice that he might get further toning down the attitude slightly and trying to be a little more inclusive. I'm under no illusion the advice will hit home but feel compelled to put finger to key as the number of pm's I've received on the subject suggest many lurkers on the forum are crying out for a counter to be made.

 

[Brian Bush]

This is a forum, not a place for a monologue but somewhere to exchange ideas and different views.
Your two posts have added nothing but criticism of any dialogue, pot calling the kettle black methinks.
Fwiw I think any attempt to improve our bees and spread knowledge should be applauded, my issue is more with the bombastic style denigrating all others, which I'm sure will kill off any longer term cooperative project lead by such a character. I don't know the man personally but would like to offer heartfelt advice that he might get further toning down the attitude slightly and trying to be a little more inclusive. I'm under no illusion the advice will hit home but feel compelled to put finger to key as the number of pm's I've received on the subject suggest many lurkers on the forum are crying out for a counter to be made.

Sorry MBC Is your criticism aimed at me, B+,or Cheers, (which ever alias he is using this week)?
If it is me please be so kind as to PM me so I can moderate my tone. I have never tried to be bombastic or denigrate anyone on this forum but apologize if any of my comments can be misconstrued. I want to be able to read posts and learn from other's experience. I do not want to see other forum members 'trolled'. I experienced it myself once on the forum and would never knowingly inflict it on others,

 

[Blacky50]

so do you have a set of guidelines for how you'd like to see it run?

B+ I would be interested in the answers to this.

 

[Beefriendly]

It would indeed be very interesting to see what the breeding strategy would be.
I suspect, knowing B+'s current system it will be steady advancement along several measurable fronts, rather than look for rapid improvement in one attribute.

 

[For want of a better word]

Cheers, (which ever alias he is using this week)?

Alias?
Due to circumstances beyond my control I could not sign in as the name I have used since 2010? ICANHOPIT... I used a new name approved by whomesoever runs this forum... to Cheers... with the same avatar, whilst I attempted to reinstate ICANHOPIT.

I see this forum wrecked by a small group of rather self opinionated and bad mannered individuals who seem to have an axe to grind with the type of bee which others choose to keep, and the type of hive they wish to keep them in.

Sensible dialogue is quickly trashed by a barrage of insults and ridicule......

 

[Swarm]

Sorry MBC Is your criticism aimed at me, B+,or Cheers, (which ever alias he is using this week)?
If it is me please be so kind as to PM me so I can moderate my tone. I have never tried to be bombastic or denigrate anyone on this forum but apologize if any of my comments can be misconstrued. I want to be able to read posts and learn from other's experience. I do not want to see other forum members 'trolled'. I experienced it myself once on the forum and would never knowingly inflict it on others,

Being a bit 'selective' with your trolling accusations.