Paper article in metro today

hiya

read a small article in the metro today that the welsh building conservation people are going to site hives on their land to give vandals something to think about when they get stung, while vandalising them and the properties they are on.

Are they at risk of being prosicuted if they are siting the hives there for that reason and advertising that fact?

I doubt it, the emphasis is on what the vandals try and do. Hopefully another candidate for the Darwin awards...

technically... they could be in hot water if the intention is to get the bees to 'attack' vandals. It's like guard dogs- by law they need to have warning signs and the dog itself either tied up or with a handler. (Guard Dog's Act 1977!)

Don't get me wrong I think you have what's coming to you if you try something like that, but in the eyes of the law you're in the schtum

but bees are considered very differently in law (insects) to dogs...

granted, but you will still be held negligent if someone gets hurt. What happens if a kid kicks his ball over and cheekily tries to climb over and get it?

If it emerged that the hives were there specifically to deter/harm intruders, you'd be screwed

shirely if the kid kicks the ball over the fence and hops over, is attacked that is just an accident as the hive is not intended to prevent that happening? They want to prevent vandals accessing the site,which is likely to be achieve by the presence of the hive, not the bees attacking anyone. I don't see the deterent as the 'attack by bees' but the presence of the hive itself. It relies on the ignorance of the vandals to work. So a significant chance it will work. Deter and harm are very different.

Nic Rhodes said:

shirely if the kid kicks the ball over the fence and hops over, is attacked that is just an accident as the hive is not intended to prevent that happening?

Click to expand...

For you or me with hives in the garden, for our pleasure, yes. But since they've advertised in the paper they are 'guard bees', the defence is gone and the courts won't look kindly on it! Not saying I agree, but that's the way the law works with this sort of thing I'm afraid.

not sure I agree, the OP said something to think about, for me they are quite within their right to site wild insects on their site . Hotels do it all over London for other reason with no come back. They have done nothing wrong. For all we know the contactors have sited the most friendly and cuddly bees on the planet (and they might prove it) on their construction site. This just relies on the vandals not knowing about bees....and how nice they can bee.

dpearce4 said:

read a small article in the metro today that the welsh building conservation people are going to site hives on their land to give vandals something to think about

Click to expand...

They've revealed their intent, bang to rights guv! Now if they'd just put the damned hives there and said nothing about it, like the hotels etc you mention... sorted!!

the intent is exactly the same as a fence, do they sue if the cut themselves whilst cutting the fence down or flattened by a falling fence panel whilst kicking it down? The intent there is also to keep the vandal out?

No because the fence is not intended to harm the intruder if they get in. Trust me on this one, if you want to do it, do it on the QT lol

still don't agree (and neither does the judge next to me!)

lol. Depends if there's warning signs up. It's similar to the case where someone rigged their car ignition to the mains to stop it being stolen. It worked, but toasted someone. Their defence was not good.

do I need warning signs in my garden?

do you have bees placed with the intent to attack intruders?

I hope they do

same as the cricket bat I have in my bedroom which I would 'just so happen' to pick up if i heard a burglar then! What with all the cricket I play, cough...

didnt think this would get a good debate like this going. lol

i must admit that i thought that as they have obviously done a press release that thats what they are going to do. if someone got stung breaking in and vanalising the site they could be prosicuted. unless the laws in wales are different.

biggest problem I have is with the fox..... are bees any good deterring foxes on chickens? Seems to the me the ignorance of the assailent is the key thing here, they run from a danger they do not fully understand and the contractor is smart enough to play on that fear, real, perceived or other.

Ferret poo works well for that I found. Probably leaving piles of it around would deter vandals I'd suppose, too