Broad boxes in a mess

[simonforeman]

Sorry for the long thread but I need advice...As some will know from my earlier threads I bought a couple of hives and equipment as a job lot in Feb.
As it's 16 degrees here today sunny and warm I decided to take my first look into the hives to check how they are doing, I was distraught...please see below my plight and any advice welcome...
Hive1
14x14 BB with 1 super. Opened up lightly smoked and bees were very calm and easy to handle. Took super off this is full with capped honey,very runner. Then I found what I didn't want to see. There is a mixture of 14x12 frames and std frames so bees have made a right mess in bottom of hive. First few frames ok with stores and bias then as I pulled other frames they were pulling apart as stuck to bottom of box. I stopped and put back together with a QE. Hive very active taking in pollen. What's best to do with this hive?
Hive 2
Again gentle bees no issues. This hive has been very quiet up to now not many bees out flying. Super was empty so removed. Then this BB is even worse there are only 7 frames and so there is comb built everywhere it's a total mess, I did not even attempt to take and frames out as they are on the piss and comb built in all directions. This is a std BB . Looks to be light on brood but some stores in box. What to do?

For info I have loads of spare frames,foundation and hive parts to build another 3 or 4 full hives. I also have 3 poly nucs with new frames in them all have 14x12 ekes on them.
My aim was and still is to get them both by the end of the season into 14x12's

I last question as both hive have stores in BB and have some fondant now. What can I do with the full super of honey on the one? I will be getting OSR soon in Area so this will be spoiled. Can I take it now and feed if required.
The bees were a bonus so if sorting them out means no honey this year it is not an issue so long as I get them sorted.

 

[Poly Hive]

Ok take a chill pill and relax it's not a disaster nor unsolvable.

Have you a couple of brood boxes that will fit?

If so then put them on top minus excluder until you see eggs in the top BB. Then add the excluder. Check in 4 days to see there are fresh eggs and if so you are pretty much sorted. I'm sure I don't need to spell the rest out as this is the critical part.

PH

 

[simonforeman]

Thanks polly...i do have BB to fit but only frames with foundation are these ok?

 

[Poly Hive]

That and a feed will do the business for you. Let the bees do the work. After she is up and safe above the excluder three weeks or so and remove the bottom BB's. Sorted.

PH

 

[Erichalfbee]

Also if you put an entrance above the excluder when your queen is up top and close the bottom entrance all the bees’ collected pollen will end up with the new brood rather than the bottom box

 

[simonforeman]

Thanks guys... will get that sorted tomorrow.

And what about the full super of honey??? Leave with the bees or take off and feed on the top new BB?

 

[colinc]

Yes give them new BBs above messy boxes allow them to move up, once up remove old BBs as stated. The full super either lift it above but then you are building a big hive if it goes cool again or remove or put it at the bottom for them to use as food to draw new comb. Lots of options but no disaster unless you try to rush it and squish or isolate a queen


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[simonforeman]

So plans not worked out as of yet as heavy rain since Sunday morning.... break in the weather tomorrow afternoon with a high of 15 degrees predicted.
So both hives will have new 14x12 BB put on top of the old ones and sugar syrup that I have made up to feed. Both boxes will have new foundation in them.

Silly question it's going to be warm but with rain predicted rest of the week apart from tomorrow afternoon will they draw out comb quicker with all the bees home?

 

[colinc]

They need bee numbers and sugar to draw frames. So weak syrup to get them going on the work if they have the pollen to raise brood.
The bees will sort it when they are ready. Overfeed and you will be harvesting syrup when you extract though


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[jenkinsbrynmair]

I'd wait until it gets warmer - it's a lot of work for the bees to get the hive up to wax producing temperature at the moment

 

[Swarm]

I'd wait until it gets warmer - it's a lot of work for the bees to get the hive up to wax producing temperature at the moment

Agreed. Plenty of time to sort out any mess when it (eventually) gets warmer.

 

[Poly Hive]

It's far too cold to start on this venture and waiting until May or even June won't hurt. Remember the BB you are putting on is a bloody big space for a "super" and personally I super on 8 frames of brood. A normal national super that is so whilst its a balance between over crowding and swarming try to exercise some caution eh?

PH

 

[simonforeman]

So update on my hives that need sorting....
I have vaped ox acid this week to bring the mites down. 1 hive is very strong with brood on 6-7 frames looking through them the other on 4+.

So with the weather on the turn as its forcast to be between 17-22 this weekend and dry all next week, can i add the new BB with foundation and feed syrup? I also have some pollen patties would you feed these also or save them now the weather is warming up and dry?
Also the OSR field 0.7 miles away will be in flower i would think next week. Will thos have a bearing on what i do?

 

[Beefriendly]

I also have some pollen patties would you feed these also or save them now the weather is warming up and dry?

No, waste of patties when they will get plenty of natural pollen.
Given where you live I'd be out on hornet watch.....

 

[simonforeman]

I saw that...... I am approx 12 miles drive from Boston....

 

[simonforeman]

Right sorry guys but some more questions on this and a plan to run past you guys on this....

My plan is as the OSR is now bursting into flower just up the road and warm weather for all this week and maybe longer. I plan to leave the BB mess for now in both hives to let them build up more and super middle of the week but this will be foundation on 1 hive and empty drawn comb on the other. When the OSR is finished flowering I will extract before it cristilizes and then add the new BB's with new foundation in both.

So here's the questions...
1. If I do this how can I check for queen cells and potential swarming as I can not remove any frames without them coming apart and they are a mess now?
2. Would I put the empty supers back on top of the new BB's?
3. Would I need to still feed with weak syrup as by the time i get to this point we are going to be 3-4 weeks down the line and hopefully warmer?

Any other advice welcome... my concern and I maybe wrong is with the OSR now flowering if I add new BB now they will fill with OSR and I can not extract and be in even more mess...
Thanks in advance simon.

 

[jenkinsbrynmair]

If there is OSR around - now is the ideal opportunity to do your Bailey change - get the brood boxes on - as soon as they have drawn it, slam QX and supers on, leave queen move up into new box, take old ones away.
Even if the brood boxes get filled with honey, extract and voila you have a box full of new comb to put the queen into.

 

[drex]

I use OSR flow to draw all my new brood frames, but then they do fit in my extractor. Quickest way to get new, good, straight brood comb