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Old 23rd April 2012, 05:35 PM   #1
rustic-Crafts
 
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Default SN1 v SN4 , DN1 v DN4 ??

I'm still reading but I see there are two different super frames SN1 and SN4. what is the difference and which is recommended for a new hive?

I see brood frames come in DN1 and DN4 - again what is the difference

If I buy a hive with SN1 super frames and DN4 brood frames - is that good, bad, Ok?

And finally : Brood boxes: A lot of you recommend 14x12 frames- will these fit a standard National Hive brood box or does it need a Eke to give extra room or is there a special 14x12 BB
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Old 23rd April 2012, 05:47 PM   #2
Rob den Dekker
 
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http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=5665
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Old 23rd April 2012, 05:51 PM   #3
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Title should read DN5 and Manley IMHO!!!!

"I'm still reading but I see there are two different super frames SN1 and SN4. what is the difference and which is recommended for a new hive?
I see brood frames come in DN1 and DN4 - again what is the difference.

DN/SN1 have narrow side bars and narrow top bars

DN/SN2 have wide top bars and narrow side bars

DN/SN4 have hoffman type side bars and narrow top bars

DN/SN5 have hoffman type side bars and wide top bars

If I buy a hive with SN1 super frames and DN4 brood frames - is that good, bad, Ok?

see my other thread - 8mm etc. - DN5 recommended (with manley bottom bars) - for super - Manley frames rather than SN.

And finally : Brood boxes: A lot of you recommend 14x12 frames- will these fit a standard National Hive brood box or does it need a Eke to give extra room or is there a special 14x12 BB"

You need either a 14x12 box or national brood + eke.
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Old 23rd April 2012, 06:33 PM   #4
itma
 
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Deep National type 4 is standard for Nat broods.
As DrS says, DN5s are probably a better choice.
Hoffman spacing is the current choice for brood frames. (And that *should* be the same for shallows used to make brood and a half ... those *should* be SN4s or 5s - but very rarely so!)


But for crop supers its about choice of spacing (how many frames in the super). And almost nothing to do with inspection convenience.
Many go for plain vanilla Shallow National type 1, and often in conjunction with castellated rails to set the spacing.
But Manley (super) frames do seem to be very much liked by those that use them. (I hope to try some, if Summer ever comes...)
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Old 24th April 2012, 10:47 PM   #5
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I think it says somewhere, you need to be aware that some extractors can't extract Manley so it would be advisable to check before using Manley frames.

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Old 24th April 2012, 11:00 PM   #6
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Mine were bought specifically to try and do some cut comb. Thin foundation, no extraction. But certainly something to watch for ...
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"Polycarbonate is better than glass, and preferably with no hole in it." -- itma
"Alligators and fire ants are considered dangerous under the Rules of Golf. Rattlesnakes and bees fall under the same heading... you are entitled to a free drop on the nearest spot that is no closer to the hole and out of danger" -- [Decision 1-4/10]
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Old 25th April 2012, 05:45 AM   #7
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Manley and extractors: you can of course trim 4mm off of each side of the bottom of the side bars (over approx 1-1.5cm) for use in normal extractors.

(another bob smith point!)
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Old 25th April 2012, 08:40 AM   #8
alanf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rustic-Crafts View Post
I'm still reading but I see there are two different super frames SN1 and SN4. what is the difference and which is recommended for a new hive?

I see brood frames come in DN1 and DN4 - again what is the difference

If I buy a hive with SN1 super frames and DN4 brood frames - is that good, bad, Ok?
You will be able to find advocates for most variations. However, looking around association apiaries around here, the most frequently seen option is DN4 on rails in the deep brood and SN1 on 10 slot castellations in the shallow super. That might have a lot to do with being the default for Th0rnes and some other suppliers, but the combination works for most people.
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