Queen Bee Equipment

As part of my Queen making this year....I have made a Queen frame to hold the Queen cells....admittedly...with a little help from OH....he did the sawing and drilling and I did the planning and put it all together.
Really pleased with the result...hope the Bees like it too.
No idea why my photos are always upside down....hey ho!
And the holders can be rotated so it is easy to put the Queen cup into the holders.

Lovely!

Tremyfro said:

No idea why my photos are always upside down....hey ho!

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Well done! Don't put them in the colony that way though ;-)
How do you plan to mate all those queens?

Ha ha ...therein lies the question. Not actually got Queen cells in them yet. Weather is so cold here...so delayed start. As soon as the temperature improves...I am going to see if I can get the Queen into the cassette. If I can't find her then I am going to have a go at transferring some larvae. There is no rush as I am not chasing honey yield with this colony. I have last years nuc which is doing well and starting to fill a super. Despite the cold weather the bees are out everyday....just not on a flow. Itching to have a go at getting Queen cells.
The new Buckfast Queen was released by the bees in the new nuc. They are very quiet now....so I think she is accepted. They were taking pollen in too so perhaps a little laying has been going on too.
I will remember to have them the right way up...ha ha ....
This weather is horribly cold and windy...even my mare refuses to have her foal....and she is hugely pregnant.

Tremyfro said:

This weather is horribly cold and windy...even my mare refuses to have her foal....and she is hugely pregnant.

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It seems to be one of those Springs...I keep looking at the forecast for a good couple of days to start grafting but it either looks cold or rainy.
Its worth having all your ducks in a row and not be waiting for equipment arriving from suppliers (i.e. mating nucs). I appreciate that its a bit of an experiment for you with the cassette but, if it doesn't work, do give grafting a go (use the very smallest larvae you can find).
The pollen going in is a good sign for the Buckfast queen. Well done.
Good luck with the foal.

The mating nucs are ready to go...all painted and just got to get a bit more king span to reduce the volume inside some of them......make it a little easier for the bees. I have one small mini mating nuc too...which I will try with a cup of bees. The hive stands arrived yesterday too. It's raining today....the weather is really regressing...but the fields needed a little rain.
I don't suppose that I will be lucky enough to make 10 Queens...but some would be good.
I will have a go at the grafting....
Failing everything....I could make a strong nuc and wait for the bees to make emergency cells......

Tremyfro said:

I don't suppose that I will be lucky enough to make 10 Queens...but some would be good.
I will have a go at the grafting....
Failing everything....I could make a strong nuc and wait for the bees to make emergency cells......

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It might suprise you how many queen cells they make. Take a look at this picture I posted in another thread
http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=33373
I got 2 bars of 15 cells out of that queenless box. It contains all of the bees from a double langstroth confined down into a single box. Often they don't accept the outer cell but, in this case, they did. I'm confident that you can get all of those cells so long as you can get larvae of the correct age. The bit I'm not confident about is the queen laying cassette - I find it much easier to graft. I'm not in favour of the emergency cell approach - they aren't very good queens but, I suppose, its a learning curve.
Good Luck !

Wow...lots of bees looking after those Queen cells.
I agree about the cassette.....when the weather improves....we will inspect the colony and if I can find the Queen....and if I can catch her easily...and if I can get her into the cassette....it will be only 24 hours. If she doesn't lay eggs then I will try the grafting. However....since my Queen catching skills are not brilliant....the chances are that I will then go straight to trying the grafting.
My plan is to ensure the Queen is in the lower Brood Box...put on a QE....and put the Queen cell frame in the top Brood Box between other frames of brood.
Then....pray....

Tremyfro said:

we will inspect the colony and if I can find the Queen....and if I can catch her easily...and if I can get her into the cassette....

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Michael Palmer did a nice instructional video on catching queens and workers on YouTube. This may help https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A2tSkW9YuHY

Tremyfro said:

My plan is to ensure the Queen is in the lower Brood Box...put on a QE....and put the Queen cell frame in the top Brood Box between other frames of brood.
Then....pray....

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You will have more success with a queenless starter colony. They can be recombined as you describe after the cells are started

So perhaps take top Brood Box off and set aside...add extra bees from frames below...use that as a starter? Then do I combine after the cells are sealed above a QE?
I will catch up later as off to eat Tapas and drink Sangria....

Tremyfro said:

So perhaps take top Brood Box off and set aside...add extra bees from frames below...use that as a starter? Then do I combine after the cells are sealed above a QE?
I will catch up later as off to eat Tapas and drink Sangria....

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No... select your largest colony.
Find and remove queen
Take all brood frames with any small larvae and or eggs and put in nuc box ( 6 full brood frame nuc .. not a mini mating nuc) + the queen from the colony.

The big colony will now be queenless and without any small larvae or eggs will not be able to start their own queens.
The cell rearing cups that should have a tiny 3 day old larvae and a good helping of royal jelly can now be placed above and between the brood combs that remain... and the young bees in the colony will do the rest for you.
On day 14 I take the queen cells and place in hair rollers in an incubator ( day 14 is the 14 day after the egg was laid,,, being day 0 )

You should get 30 to 50 queens this way

When you have finished the nuc + the original queen ( by now bursting with bees) can be recombined, so you can go on to collect a respectable honey crop of 120lbs + in your area!

I generally use a queenright colony of my NZ Liguarian bees to rear my Amm queens.... just because they are worthy surrogates and easy to handle.
{ the Amm colonies are continuously being split to open mate and provide for increase... as per Dave Cushman's method for making increase... that may be a better way for a beginner to raise more colonies?}

BIBBA also have a good webpage for queen rearing... may be worth a look.


Yeghes da

icanhopit said:

You should get 30 to 50 queens this way

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Yes. I agree. This is a good method for producing lots of queens, but, she is only trying to make 10 at the most.

Tremyfro said:

So perhaps take top Brood Box off and set aside...add extra bees from frames below...use that as a starter? Then do I combine after the cells are sealed above a QE?
I will catch up later as off to eat Tapas and drink Sangria....

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You have to be sure there aren't any eggs/larvae in the starter colony. The nurse bees should have no choice except to feed the larvae you introduce. This is how you get well fed queens. They only need to be nursed this way for 24 hours (but I want them to be packed full of royal jelly so I leave it until they are sealed). After 24 hours, you can put the started cells back ontop of the queenright portion of the colony above a queen excluder. The nurse bees will continue to feed the started cells and keep them warm. Be very careful to keep track of the ages of your cells. I transfer them to an incubator once they are sealed but you will be using the colony to do this.
On the 10th day after grafting the cells will be mature and the queen will ready to emerge. This is the absolute latest they can be transferred into your mating nucs. If there is any doubt about the age of the larva you graft, you'll need to transfer them sooner.

On the 10th day after grafting the cells will be mature and the queen will ready to emerge. This is the absolute latest they can be transferred into your mating nucs. If there is any doubt about the age of the larva you graft, you'll need to transfer them sooner.

I count the day I put q to Jenter as day 0 ... so your day 14 is the same, as you will be picking up 2 to 4 day old larvae?

TREF... be careful not to move q cells around too soon after they have been capped off....as they can easily be damaged.
A LOT of skill involved, but brilliant when it works for you!

Not in reality a method of increase I would recommend for a beginner in beekeeping.


Yeghes da

Gosh...thanks guys for all the help...I know I am probably trying to run before I can walk.....but it seems such an interesting way of getting Queens. As you say...some skill involved...I will try to do this. I am going to write down each stage...so it is easier to remember each part and not miss anything out. I think the most difficult bit will be making sure all the young larvae and eggs are with the Queen....it will be a challenge.....the bottom Brood Box is 14x12 frames...so a lot to check. What do I do if each of the large frames have some eggs on them....would it still work if there are fewer frames of brood...older brood....but most of the bees are shook into the box with the Queen cell frame? Just thinking ahead...so I can deal with it all when standing next to the hive. Also...just to make sure I understand this....the Queen and eggs and young larvae box stays on the old hive stand and the other box with all the nurse bees is moved to one side?
Now all we need is some good weather......

Tremyfro said:

I think the most difficult bit will be making sure all the young larvae and eggs are with the Queen....it will be a challenge.....the bottom Brood Box is 14x12 frames...so a lot to check. What do I do if each of the large frames have some eggs on them....would it still work if there are fewer frames of brood...older brood....but most of the bees are shook into the box with the Queen cell frame? Just thinking ahead...so I can deal with it all when standing next to the hive. Also...just to make sure I understand this....the Queen and eggs and young larvae box stays on the old hive stand and the other box with all the nurse bees is moved to one side?
Now all we need is some good weather......

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Shaking the bees into the cell starter is a "crude but effective" method of getting enough nurses to start the cells. Be careful that you don't take all of the bees away from the queen/brood though. They need support too.
If you leave the queenright portion on the parent stand, they will receive all of the flying bees upon their return from foraging.
Its a good thing if you can arrange for a frame of pollen and open nectar to be next to your grafts so the nurses have immediate access to food.

Yes...I have plenty of open nectar and pollen frames. So can ensure the Queen cells box of nurse bees have enough.
So here is the breakdown...
Get cells/ very young larvae from cassette or grafting...depends on which method is possible at the time....into Queen cups.
Separate brood boxes...leaving Queen with all young larvae and eggs and foragers on old hive site.
Make sure each box has enough bees.
Put Queen cells onto Queen frame and put into top box, which is moved aside, between as many frames of old or sealed brood as possible. With open nectar and pollen. Make sure enough nurse bees.
Remember to note the days. 10 days from grafting, 14 days if from cassette.
Can unite the two brood boxes after 24 hours but can leave until capping for maximum royal jelly food. Unite over QE.
On 10th or 14th day....put into mating nucs....which were prepared the day before adding Queen cells.
Make sure all nucs have sufficient food and bees. Dummy down with insulation if in 6 frame nuc to 3 frames. Or in mini mating nuc...a cupful of bees plus food.
Wait for Queens to mate and begin to lay.
For Hive 2 and 3 .....find and remove old Queen to a small nuc....add one of the mated Queens after being Queenless for 24 hours. If accepted and laying ....then can dispatch the old buzzy Queens and reunite the nuc.
Phew...if I manage all this.....total awesomeness....if I manage some of it.....it will still feel good.

Apidea ( mating nuc) need to be stocked up with young bees and locked in for some days to allow them to start drawing down comb
Seems the most successful method to stock the apidea is to firstly carry out something like an AS, shaking all bees into a brood with qe over ( to keep out drones) and lifting brood frames above... 24 hrs later harvest young bees from top box above qe
Do this with a couple of strong colonies from each of at least 3 apiaries and mix up bees with a misting of weak sugar water.... inhibits absconding.
Put a mug full of bees into each apidea, lock in place in dark cool place for 3 days. Take apidea to mating site and fix to posts and allow to fly before introducing virgin queens.

Allow at least 10 days before looking for eggs... and another 10 to make sure capped brood is worker. Cull any drone layers.
Apidea can be recycled.

Join or start a bee breeding group.... probably one already going at your local association.... breeding local bees probably!

Good luck

Yeghes da

Most of our mini nucs are run all year round, so just a case of adding ripe cells after removal of mated queens, plus splitting mini nucs to make more as they get stronger.
The apideas and swi-bines are started fresh each spring, starter strips fitted and feed compartment filled, usually at the apiary the boxes are lined up with the floor slides open, young bees are shaken from the super combs of multiple colonies into a meshed shaker box, these are then measured out into each mini nuc and the slide closed. Around two hours later a virgin is run in from a roller cage through entrance of each nuc, they are then kept confined for two nights to bond before being placed out in position, last thing, just before dark.