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MikeT

MikeT

Field Bee
Joined
Oct 19, 2014
Messages
645
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0
Location
West Norfolk
Hive Type
National
Number of Hives
5
Fen blows in the fens of Norfolk and Cambridgeshire, sand storms on the Brecks of Norfolk, caused by the wing at over 60mph. This is causing serious problems for onion, carrot and sugar beet growers, by blowing out the seed and removing herbicides from the fields. This will mean redrilling of sugar bee and carrots, getting too late for onions.
 
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I noticed significant wind driven soil erosion on newly drilled fields near me today - the ones without hedges...the hedged fields were fine.
I imagine redrilling will be required. Hedgeplanting would be a good idea too.

As a farmer's daughter who retained his hedges, it grieves me to see a "wide open Wednesday." (Suffolk saying for an agricultural desert.)
Cazza
 
Cazza said:
I noticed significant wind driven soil erosion on newly drilled fields near me today - the ones without hedges...the hedged fields were fine.
I imagine redrilling will be required. Hedgeplanting would be a good idea too.

As a farmer's daughter who retained his hedges, it grieves me to see a "wide open Wednesday." (Suffolk saying for an agricultural desert.)
Cazza
Click to expand...

I have planted a km of mixed hedge around part of my field, mainly hawthorn with blackthorn, field maple, dog rose plus a few other native spp. Should look good in about 3 yrs time.

Mike
 
We got the Welsh to build the Brecons but they left too many gaps and the wind is hitting the house like a sledgehammer !
E
 
Cazza said:
I noticed significant wind driven soil erosion on newly drilled fields near me today - the ones without hedges...the hedged fields were fine.
I imagine redrilling will be required. Hedgeplanting would be a good idea too.

As a farmer's daughter who retained his hedges, it grieves me to see a "wide open Wednesday." (Suffolk saying for an agricultural desert.)
Cazza
Click to expand...

The sensible ones kept the hedges, the avarice driven stripped them out, filled in ancient drainage ditches and created prairie farms which the wind proceeded to denude of topsoil. Fifty years ago soil drifts completely blocked one of our local roads to a depth of 16". :(
 
We used to live on the edge of the Marlborough Downs and there wasn't a hedge to be seen. when it snowed our village would have 10 ft. snowdrifts blocking the only entry/ exit, all of the weather blew off the downs down to us, no work, and no pay for some, for a few days. Isn't "modern" farming wonderful.

BUT they could plough with a 12 furrow reversible plough 24/7which they did.
 
Gilberdyke John said:
created prairie farms which the wind proceeded to denude of topsoil. (
Click to expand...

Luckily the neclosure acts of the late 18th early 19th century stopped all that and people started planting hedges.......................... Agrarian cycle on a larger scale perhaps?

When SWMBO worked in Welsh Government agriculture she visited what was deemed a 'model farm' by WG up Aberystwyth way it was, many years ago a collection of small farms brought together as one holding by 'father' in the 1970's to gain loads of grants to grub up most of the hedges (not arable prairie land mind) then at the beginning of this century old man has retired and the holding has again been split into three smaller holdings in the names of the sons in order to..........................gain loads and loads of grants to re-plant the hedges!!!!!!
 
jenkinsbrynmair said:
Luckily the neclosure acts of the late 18th early 19th century stopped all that and people started planting hedges.......................... Agrarian cycle on a larger scale perhaps?

When SWMBO worked in Welsh Government agriculture she visited what was deemed a 'model farm' by WG up Aberystwyth way it was, many years ago a collection of small farms brought together as one holding by 'father' in the 1970's to gain loads of grants to grub up most of the hedges (not arable prairie land mind) then at the beginning of this century old man has retired and the holding has again been split into three smaller holdings in the names of the sons in order to..........................gain loads and loads of grants to re-plant the hedges!!!!!!
Click to expand...

The enclosure acts often specified the digging of boundary ditches with the earth thrown up on the owners side and the planting of thorn in the bank thus formed. This gave rise to the principle "your hedge, your dyke" when it came to maintenance. The thorn was used as it could be made stockproof.
 
Gilberdyke John said:
The enclosure acts often specified the digging of boundary ditches with the earth thrown up on the owners side and the planting of thorn in the bank thus formed. This gave rise to the principle "your hedge, your dyke" when it came to maintenance. The thorn was used as it could be made stockproof.
Click to expand...

Yep, and before then most of the UK was one big unhedged plain in fact reading an interesting book a few years ago on the history of rabbits and warrens (warrens varied in size from tens to hundreds of acres)some parts of Lincolnshire and others in the East of the coutry were just barren windswept plains ontil enclosure and arable farming became of interest again
 
MikeT said:
Fen blows in the fens of Norfolk and Cambridgeshire, sand storms on the Brecks of Norfolk, caused by the wing at over 60mph. This is causing serious problems for onion, carrot and sugar beet growers, by blowing out the seed and removing herbicides from the fields. This will mean redrilling of sugar bee and carrots, getting too late for onions.
Click to expand...

I am suprised to hear a farmer complaining about this when it is actually farmers that are wholey responsible for ripping out hedgerows to increase yield of crops , thus causing the decline of nesting habitats & land erosion as you say from wind. Only farmers are responsible so only them can put it right although they will probably wait untill they are offered subsidies to do so!
 
jonnybeegood said:
I am suprised to hear a farmer complaining about this when it is actually farmers that are wholey responsible for ripping out hedgerows to increase yield of crops , thus causing the decline of nesting habitats & land erosion as you say from wind. Only farmers are responsible so only them can put it right although they will probably wait untill they are offered subsidies to do so!
Click to expand...

I have to answer this one. Before you comment check your facts, You are again showing your ignorance of British Agriculture

The Fens are reclaimed land and have never had hedges to any extent. There was much planting of willow in the 1970s to improve the wind protections. The Brecks again have never had much hedging but there are large tracks of woodland belts areas of carr with grassland woods along the rivers . The farmers in these areas are particularly concerned about wind erosion and do much to prevent it. Crops are planted with nurse crops or straw was planted to provide mini wind breaks. Farmers cannot risk loss of crops for those that cost £1000s/ha to establish. In these areas I am not aware of any hedges being removed as they are regarded as valuable enhancement of the countryside. Where trees that have had to be removed because of age, these are replaced. Tree felling to any large extent has to be approved by the Forestry Commission and a licence must be obtained.

Work was also undertaken by MAFF between the 1970s and 80 to protect the fenland soils from erosion, by using soil mixing, selecting the most suitable windbreak spp.

There are grants available to plant hedges and trees but the amount is small compared to the to the cost of planting. Farmers are also encouraged to maintain hedges and in field trees within the Entry and Higher Level Schemes. It is also part of the Cross Compliance regulations if field boundaries are not maintained and farmers can be fined if they do not comply.

Also lettuce, other salad and Brassica crops are grown in the Brecks and Fenland and if the crop is contaminated with soil it would be rejected for Supermarket sales, therefore it is essential to protect the soil from wind erosion.

Many of the Farmers who produce crops for the supermarkets are members of the LEAF Marque Tesco Nurture and Field to Fork, and as part of their membership have to encourage wildlife diversification. Hedges are planted, pollen, nectar area are sown, wild bird mixes are used and unproductive areas are planted with indigenous trees and bushes. So farmers are now doing much to encourage our wide and varied flora and fauna, by providing nesting sites and winter food.

So in future check your facts before you comment. :facts::facts:

I'm now going back to the ignore button
 
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MikeT said:
I have to answer this one. Before you comment check your facts, You are again showing your ignorance of British Agriculture

The Fens are reclaimed land and have never had hedges to any extent. There was much planting of willow in the 1970s to improve the wind protections. The Brecks again have never had much hedging but there are large tracks of woodland belts areas of carr with grassland woods along the rivers . The farmers in these areas are particularly concerned about wind erosion and do much to prevent it. Crops are planted with nurse crops or straw was planted to provide mini wind breaks. Farmers cannot risk loss of crops for those that cost £1000s/ha to establish. In these areas I am not aware of any hedges being removed as they are regarded as valuable enhancement of the countryside. Where trees that have had to be removed because of age, these are replaced. Tree felling to any large extent has to be approved by the Forestry Commission and a licence must be obtained.

Work was also undertaken by MAFF between the 1970s and 80 to protect the fenland soils from erosion, by using soil mixing, selecting the most suitable windbreak spp.

There are grants available to plant hedges and trees but the amount is small compared to the to the cost of planting. Farmers are also encouraged to maintain hedges and in field trees within the Entry and Higher Level Schemes. It is also part of the Cross Compliance regulations if field boundaries are not maintained and farmers can be fined if they do not comply.

Also lettuce, other salad and Brassica crops are grown in the Brecks and Fenland and if the crop is contaminated with soil it would be rejected for Supermarket sales, therefore it is essential to protect the soil from wind erosion.

Many of the Farmers who produce crops for the supermarkets are members of the LEAF Marque Tesco Nurture and Field to Fork, and as part of their membership have to encourage wildlife diversification. Hedges are planted, pollen, nectar area are sown, wild bird mixes are used and unproductive areas are planted with indigenous trees and bushes. So farmers are now doing much to encourage our wide and varied flora and fauna, by providing nesting sites and winter food.

So in future check your facts before you comment. :facts::facts:

I'm now going back to the ignore button
Click to expand...

Must be different where you are to here then. Here they rip out hedges or coppice them deliberatly badly so they dont grow back & fence the fields instead. Hedgerows are cut both sides & topped every winter, sometimes twice making them useless for wildlife. Roadside banks are cut to the ground removing all brambles & veggitation animals may be hibernating in. Hedgerows that are cut out are piled up to burn months later when either birds are nesting in the huge pile or other animals have made a home. No wild flowers planted anywhere, even dandelions in sileage fields are treated with round up to kill them. Land set aside for wildlife is usually dug over after 3 years just as the wildlife has started to move in. This is what i see of farmers, money comes before wildlife for the majority of them.
 
Let me know were you are and I will check what the situation is with my colleagues, who do LEAF and Tesco Nurture in the North
 
As an explanation for 'yield', everybody sensible, within agriculture,quotes tons per acre or tonnes per hectare as the yield. Clearly the yield will be unnaffected by the area planted.

Ripping out hedges increased the area and therefore the total crop, but the yield will be the same. Makes little difference to wind or self pollinated crops but for insect pollinated, the yield often tends to be better around the margins of huge fields than distant to the hedges.

Even hay crops tended to be heavier adjacent to hedgerows - whether due to shelter or better soil from the ditch clearing, I could not be sure.

Our grass fields were of the old ridge and furrow format, so the previous ploughing was quite possibly carried out by steam - so the headland would have been cultivated separately to the middle areas of them. That was before my time. I think one arable field may have been steam ploughed in my lifetime, but I cannot remember for sure. I do remember that same field was harvested by binder and my Gramp reseeded the field with a 'fiddle' as an 'undersown' crop. Memories are dim from well over 60 years ago....
 
Must be different where you are to here then. Here they rip out hedges or coppice them deliberatly badly so they dont grow back & fence the fields instead. Hedgerows are cut both sides & topped every winter, sometimes twice making them useless for wildlife. Roadside banks are cut to the ground removing all brambles & veggitation animals may be hibernating in. Hedgerows that are cut out are piled up to burn months later when either birds are nesting in the huge pile or other animals have made a home. No wild flowers planted anywhere, even dandelions in sileage fields are treated with round up to kill them. Land set aside for wildlife is usually dug over after 3 years just as the wildlife has started to move in. This is what i see of farmers, money comes before wildlife for the majority of them.

If that's the case DEFRA are making serious money out of farmers in your area by fines for non compliance of the Cross Compliance regulations.

AS an, example a farm in the fens was fined 3% of his area payment totally £8000 for allowing soil to drop on to his field margins while ridging up his potatoes.
There are strict rules of when and how often hedges are cut and again serious fines can be imposed by DEFRA if the rules are not obeyed.
 
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