beevital hive clean

MuswellMetro said:

i was not quoting use of treatment during a honey flow, it is only you

Iwould suggest that almost all if not all of the 24,000 of the BBKA member do not test their honey for EC. HMF or Diastase, so i am in the majority of of beekeepers in the uk, Bee farmers and Honey Processor yes, they may be testing but not the 24000 bbka memeber. Complience is just by good beekeeping practice, nothing else except % water content

I am sorry but i dont think you live in the real world of beekeeping in the uk and if you are giving input on the registration of beehive, May the Gods help us

i have put a poll up, lets see how the forum responds

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you said I was irresponsible for suggesting people use natural essential oils to treat disease, you also stated this was illegal. I simply pointed out that apart from bees collecting some them naturally (if available) there is no law that says you can not use them. Now whey up the irresponsibility of something that wouldnt affect honey, to selling honey to members of the public without even knowing if it conforms to legal requirements!

The fact your telling me most dont do basic testing and yet sell to the public i find horrifying. The rules on food stuffs are there to protect consumers, are you seriously trying to say its perfectly ok to simply assume your honey complies with the law?

The majority of people speed, this dosnt make it legal nor does it protect from prosecution, god help the beek who has his honey reported because someone 'thinks' it caused stomach upset, it wouldnt matter if the honey was responsible or not, if it was found to not comply the producer would be in serious trouble.

What I have advocated has zero effect on honey, it can be effective and even if it was found in your hive how would it be proved that the bees didnt feed on the parent plant?

One last question. since most of the tests would be simple and cheap to do, why do beeks consider it unreasonable to do them and yet sell the honey?

I am extremely interested in the poll, if what you say is correct then this is certainly something i will raise with associations and the relevant government departments.

As for living in the real world, you quoted law to me, and stated there was no requirement to test, did you not? I then pointed out the while the law dosnt say you must test, what it does say is honey must m,eet the standards i have posted, by default the only way to be sure you are legally complying and selling honey fit for consumption is to test it, or do you have another way or working out the EC for example by merely looking at it?

If honey is compliment then why should any food producer comply with the legal standards? what make beeks so special they assume to be above the law? And yes I am involved in the new legal framework, and from what your telling me, yes god help you

Erichalfbee said:

Could I ask whether your wife....or you for that matter...test your honey to make sure it meets all the criteria in the schedule?

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My wife dosnt sell honey, in fact she is more interested in wax, i do test her honey via gas chromatograph and mass spectrometer, however this is done for different reasons to compliance, the tests i do are in the main to determine the level and type of pesticides the bees are exposed to in our area.

If she did sell honey then yes we would comply and test, i dont have a choice. Imagine the problems i would face if my wife was found not to be complying with the law!!

Would we test if we sold to the public and i wasnt a scientist? yes because I wouldnt want to risk an expensive legal battle if something went wrong.

Would we test if we gave a couple of jars away to mates and I wasnt involved in what I do? No probably not.

I have answered as honestly as i can

Dr J.Bell said:

having just checked it is now a precursor and restricted!

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It's not a precursor - it's on the poisons side of the list, been there for years, the only change is, now there's a licence requirement.

jenkinsbrynmair said:

It's not a precursor - it's on the poisons side of the list, been there for years, the only change is, now there's a licence requirement.

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Do you have a link where you found that info? I have found 3 different entries!! All different, thankfully not my job to make sure we comply , also noticed they have snuck a couple on since we first got our list!

Completely confusing now, one of the main ph indicators used in a lab is on the restricted list! utterly bizarre.

We had an updated list back in Jan and yet on the system i see an amendment dated dec last year but it isnt included.

On our system Oxalic is a drug and explosive precursor!! Ok I am only a Bio Chemist and not a Chemist but how can you possibly make an illegal drug from it!

Sorry ranting over yet more stupidity of regulation!

Oh and 3 very common and well used stains for microscope work are now banned! And we seem to have gone from no license needed as a company to having to pay £1,300 for one lol

Logan have you got school in the morning,it's past your bedtime....
Admin.

Is this the end of the Bell?

Dr J.Bell said:

Do you have a link where you found that info?

We had an updated list back in Jan and yet on the system i see an amendment dated dec last year but it isnt included.

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http://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/ProductInformationDatabase/Search.aspx

Find bees under other in the drop down species list.

Your search will return relevant results under each heading for ‘Current Authorised Products’, ‘Expired Products’, ‘Suspended Products’, ‘Registered Homeopathics’ and ‘Specified Feed Additives’, please navigate to the required tab. Please note the search results will default to the ‘Current Authorised Products’ tab.

Dr J.Bell said:

The fact your telling me most dont do basic testing and yet sell to the public i find horrifying. The rules on food stuffs are there to protect consumers, are you seriously trying to say its perfectly ok to simply assume your honey complies with the law?

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If your honey is just honey (ie: you have not fed them sugar water) and you have a properly kept medicines sheet for your hives and only use those drugs listed on the allowed list below then you shouldn't need to have your honey tested. Of course if you randomly add essential oils, egg whites and all sorts of other 'interesting' things then that would be different.

http://www.vmd.defra.gov.uk/ProductInformationDatabase/Search.aspx

Dr J.Bell said:

Actually as Bee keepers I would argue it makes sense to register a LTD company, offset your tax and you can also legally posses any of the precursors, all for £45 or whatever LTD's cost.

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The forum has been around this particular issue a few times in the past .. our resident tax and legal expert produced a very comprehensive set of posts. Here :

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=32799

You have to be sure that it really IS a business and not just an expensive hobby before you start thinking about registering as a business.

In addition - as a hobbyist there is now an income tax exemption for 'profits' from your hobby of less than £1000. Judging by what my beekeeping costs me from the six (now seven !) hives I have - I doubt that I would make a profit - but, trying to offset beekeeping losses against other earned income is a recipe for a visit from HMRC ... and that's something you really don't want !

pargyle said:

The forum has been around this particular issue a few times in the past .. our resident tax and legal expert produced a very comprehensive set of posts. Here :

http://www.beekeepingforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=32799

You have to be sure that it really IS a business and not just an expensive hobby before you start thinking about registering as a business.

In addition - as a hobbyist there is now an income tax exemption for 'profits' from your hobby of less than £1000. Judging by what my beekeeping costs me from the six (now seven !) hives I have - I doubt that I would make a profit - but, trying to offset beekeeping losses against other earned income is a recipe for a visit from HMRC ... and that's something you really don't want !

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Dr J Bell is a troll

MuswellMetro said:

Dr J Bell is a troll

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Blimey ... he's a well read troll then ... good command of English and I reckon it was 40/Love to him against finnie ...

Entertaining if nothing else ...

I thought it might be this bloke:

http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/aboutus/people/logan.james

pargyle said:

Blimey ... he's a well read troll then ... good command of English and I reckon it was 40/Love to him against finnie ...

Entertaining if nothing else ...

I thought it might be this bloke:

http://www.lshtm.ac.uk/aboutus/people/logan.james

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Pargyle,

- do you think that somebody's reputation is so useless, that you can draw who ever person to this funny forum game?

- do you think that it is enough, when you represent me to everyone, that I have banned from every forum on Globe? And your stories are false.

- be ashamed as adult person. ... Look into your pants who you are.

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Finman said:

Pargyle,

- do you think that somebody's reputation is so useless, that you can draw who ever person to this funny forum game?

- do you think that it is enough, when you represent me to everyone, that I have banned from every forum on Globe? And your stories are false.

- be ashamed as adult person. ... Look into your pants who you are.

.

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. So, you do not understand what you are doing. I wonder what your mom would say when he see your "jokes".
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