Dummy Boards

Given that I am on National single b/b what is the opinion of others on the value of a dummy board for ease of inspections weighed against the loss of valuable space. I am mindful that a National b/b is probabaly bordering on insufficient space for a healthy full colony but am reluctant to go to brood and a half or change to larger boxes in only my 2nd year. I guess brood and a half is probably inevitable but would value the thoughts of others.

Some beekeepers still persist in cramming 12 frames into a national brood box and then wonder why they have problems removing the end comb at each inspection rolling and upsetting their bees( some even manage to break the lugs off the end frames). Dummy boards have so many uses that I can't imagine beekeeping without them.

bite the bullet and go 14x12. you won't look back.

or modify a poly LS so you can run national frames crossways with a couple of extra.

Another option is double brood, therefore keeping all brood frames the same size.

drstitson said:

bite the bullet and go 14x12.

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or

use double brood (Two National deeps) with dummy boards if you desire.

If the queen requires more space to lay then give it.

masterBK said:

Some beekeepers still persist in cramming 12 frames into a national brood box

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Unless they use the wider spacing, then they have no hope.

Hivemaker. said:

Unless they use the wider spacing, then they have no hope.

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I went 14x12 in my second year as my first year brood and half experience wasnt good.
Works for me.

Pete D

I thought someone would like that

How I wish the UK just used Langstroff as standard. Why do we have to be so awkward?

Bates said:

How I wish the UK just used Langstroff as standard. Why do we have to be so awkward?

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Which type of Langstroth? There are around 90 different sub species.

parkranger said:

Given that I am on National single b/b what is the opinion of others on the value of a dummy board for ease of inspections weighed against the loss of valuable space. I am mindful that a National b/b is probably bordering on insufficient space for a healthy full colony but am reluctant to go to brood and a half or change to larger boxes in only my 2nd year. I guess brood and a half is probably inevitable but would value the thoughts of others.

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"One or more deep brood boxes serving as a brood chamber" is what is described in advisory leaflet 367 (on Scottish Beekeepers site and elsewhere). Yet phrases such as "national hives are too small for modern bees" are frequently repeated by those who have never read the standard.

Double deep brood works for some of us over the summer, some colonies reduce to deep plus shallow super of stores over winter. I like the versatility, including moving frames between boxes and demaree or splits vertically. Others like 14x12 as a brood box, entirely their choice. Or commercial broods under national supers. "Brood and a half" or deep plus shallow all year round is used by quite a few and they seem happy with it. Managing three or more different frame sizes is almost certainly worth avoiding as a strategy, but some put up with even that.

11 frames plus dummy works for me. Allows an inspection through the box moving each frame only once without inviting extra propolis or comb.

Bates said:

How I wish the UK just used Langstroff as standard. Why do we have to be so awkward?

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Because we're British!!

parkranger said:

Given that I am on National single b/b what is the opinion of others on the value of a dummy board for ease of inspections weighed against the loss of valuable space. I am mindful that a National b/b is probabaly bordering on insufficient space for a healthy full colony but am reluctant to go to brood and a half or change to larger boxes in only my 2nd year. I guess brood and a half is probably inevitable but would value the thoughts of others.

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I use single brood national (Hoffman frames) eleven frames and a dummy board - works fine for me

.
We had once a "Finland hive" but it was a straight copy from a "Sweden hive".

drstitson said:

bite the bullet and go 14x12. you won't look back.

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I'm moving to 14x12 this year, I think it's going to make live easier.

Parkranger - you say you have 3 colonies and use Nationals, so to try to help you get the most out of the equipment you have.

I run mainly Nationals, single brood, Double, or brood and half, whichever suits that particular colony. I always use dummy boards as they make manipulations so much easier. Give it a try and see what works for you. Like I do, you might judge it wrong and have overflowing bees or lots of empty space ( which you can still dummy down).

If you consider going 14x12 you could always convert your BB's with an eke.

Lots of options. Make up your own mind - the bees will not care much either way as long as they are warm and dry. _ I shall now put on the tin hat.

It's obviously all down to personal preference. For me the bigger the frame the less frames you have to lift out if looking for queen cells etc.. You can dummy down a big box to any size using an insulated dummy.

Dadant blatt.

Rewind.
A dummy board should be a neater way of using 11 frames in the BB.
Not an alternative to jamming in 12.

If you think you need 12 frames, then go a different way - 14x12 is a good way. Others would prefer brood and a half or double brood. I don't, but respect some of the reasons people have for choosing multi-brood.




Dummy boards themselves.
They really should present a completely flat face towards the end frame.
Using an ordinary frame with a board nailed on just doesn't make a flat face.

Why flat?
Because you'd benefit from the comb having the same beespace whether it is against the dummy or the end wall. Having a *flat* dummy board allows you to inspect by removing the dummy, moving the frames up as they are inspected, and finishing by replacing the dummy at the opposite end of the rails from where it started. To do this effectively, the dummy board must be just as flat as the hive end wall - at least on the side turned towards the comb.

There, I feel better now.

I went 14x12 second year, baileys comb change, job done, converted brood boxes with an eke, never looked back